Chronic Pain

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I'm starting this thread to get some things off my chest. Please don't think for a moment that I'm looking for pity - But rather, perhaps someone here has a scenario similar to mine or perhaps there is some good advice to be shared.

I injured my back during weightlifting in January of 2008, and I've never been the same since. I was doing my regular rounds of squats when I felt a sudden stab in the thoracic (mid) part of my back. I am now, about 1.5 years later, in chronic 24/7 pain. I can't sit straight because my back feels..."off". There is a constant, annoying reminder that something is horribly wrong with my spine.

I've received every MRI, CT scan, bone scan and X-ray known to man, yet the doctors (I have visited 4 including 1 GP, 2 Orthopedic Surgeons, and 1 Pain Management Specialist) are unable to find any point of significance in the test results aside from minor scoliosis (curvature of the spine) and yet they all agree that a muscular problem would have healed by now. Their "solutions" bounce back and forth between more exercise, pills, physical therapy and spinal steroid injections, all of which have failed miserably in providing any sort of long-term relief. My chiropractic visits also turned out to be worthless in the long run.

Fortunately, I'm still mobile and able to do moderate weightlifting and things I enjoy like hiking, running, etc., but I am honestly having trouble coping with this. It could be worse, of course - much worse. I try to take it like a champ most days because nobody likes being around someone who complains all the time...but some days it gets the best of me. One of the most frustrating things about this situation is that the very hobby I was trying to use to improve myself is the one that has screwed up my body. Life is different. Pain is the first thing I think about when I wake up, and the last thing I think about whenever I go to bed.

It's hard for someone to understand who doesn't share a similar experience; understandably so. I wouldn't have understood before the injury. Hopefully this passage isn't too gloomy; except for this, I greatly enjoy life. I have a good job and an even better girlfriend. And if I do heal from this, God willing...I believe I will emerge from this a better person. One who no longer takes some things for granted.

Do you have a similar experience or a good recommendation? Do tell.

 

It could be many things unfortunately. Some can be aggravated by improper form or using too much weight or even genetics.
Spinal Stenosis
Possibly a herniated muscle pinching a nerve(very hard to detect) although that will typically be more of a "burning" &/or "piercing"pain.
Lumbar sprain or tearing of the ligaments.
It could even be a "stinger", i got one in my right arm trying to push through too much weight benching & ended up screwing up my form. I felt a "pop" and had tingles & "electric shock" type pain in the last 3 fingers of my right hand & outer forearm for almost 2 years after it happened.

If you laid off squats but continued doing leg lifts & crunches you can actually make it worse or prolong it getting better.

Sorry i didn't have any definitive help. Best of luck & hope things get better.

PS Oh yeah, don't seat up straight!!
Reclining at about a 135 Degree angle puts much less stress on your back than a stiff 90 Degree straight up angle.

 

I've had back problems for years due to 'minor scoliosis'. The thing with doctors is that their definition of minor is generally a lot more painful than they think!

I've given up with medical treatments now for various reasons but I do find that regular massage is very helpful. The reason being is that subconciously (my spelling is appalling!), when you have a back problem you tend to hold yourself quite stiffly and this aggrivates it. Also, wearing a wide belt helps to give some support and relief. It's probably easier for me, being a girl and all though!

 

Probably worse as(i think) you have indicated that you are . . . . . rather well endowed. That can cause back pain all be itself(but it makes all the guys happy).

 

Duh...chiropractors are crooks. They make the problem *much* worse on the first visit, and ensure you that over the course of hundreds of future visits, you'll eventually get better. Sounds like job security to me....


This is actually quite recent....but about a month ago, some b**ch hit my car while I was stopped at a red light. While I felt fine immediately afterwards, the pain set in about 24 hours later. At first it was crippling pain... But the pain has eased off to the point where I can function. About half way though my 12 hour shift, my back will start acting up, shooting pain down from my lower back (centered on the spine), to my right leg. My right knee has been f***ed up for several years now, so when the pain from my back hits my knee, my knee shoots pain back up...which causes me to lurch in pain...which then aggravates my back even more. The only way to stop the cycle, is to just stop everything and just stand there for a bit while I try to relax.

I've found that taking an anti-inflammatory (800mg of Ibprophen to be exact), along with stretching in a near-scalding shower helps the most....but it's only a temporary solution to the pain.

A deep tissue massage felt great, and the pain was gone! I could move in ways that I've haven't been able to since the accident...but as soon as I got home (45 minutes later), the pain was back, so that clearly isn't a long term solution...but I still recommend getting a massage, just because they feel so awesome! Don't get a deep tissue massage if you've never had one before...go with a "traditional" Swedish massage (a.k.a. a relaxation massage).

 

Chronic pain? Live with it.

Serisously though, might want to try meditating, yoga, or tàijíquán.

You don't have to get too much into the mystic mubo-jumbo in these, but they're good excercises and there's plenty about relaxation techniques in all of them.

Depends on the preferences though, it'd be nice to have a fast 'n easy way out of pain, and these take years of practice even to get to a decent beginning. But it is possible to learn to "listen" to your body and your muscles better, and learn to react to or "ignore" pain in an efficient way through them.

I don't use painkillers, but I've never had chronic pain. Just acute & repeating bouts of serious "ow damnit I can't move!" type of pain, but I manage to get it away by "meditating" (it's such a hippieBS loaded word that I hate to use it, but there you go...).

 

I agree with martaug - it certainly sounds like a herniated muscle or a herniated disc, pressing against a nerve. If that's the case, the pain you are feeling is because blood flow has been restricted to the nerves in that area. I have a herniated disk in my neck (which I did not herniate lifting weights). The good news is that the nerve with the restricted blood flow eventually dies, at which point it won't hurt anymore. The bad news is that the time frame for the nerve to die is typically years - sometimes decades. The inury to my neck occured about five years ago, and it still hurts every day.

Since I don't like being constantly medicated, I usually just deal with it. I agree with Kitrax that showering with very warm water and stretching do help get you moving in the morning. It also seems that the level of pain is somewhat weather-dependent. On warm days, the pain isn't so bad, but on cold wet days, it hurts almost as much as when it first happened.

I've been to doctors too, and there's nothing a doctor can do to treat the injury short of spinal surgery, which most doctors would recommend against. What they do is remove the herniated disc from your back and surgically fuse two of you vertebrae together. The surgery is not without risk, and the recovery from the surgury is about one full year, so unless the pain is debilitating to the point where you can no longer function, it is not recommended.

 

They would have seen the herniated disk with an MRI. I had the surgery done several years ago and it wasn't that bad. The up side to surgery is the pressure is immediately removed and most patients have an immediate relief from the pain. The downside is you're going under the knife and it takes a bit to recover (a few weeks). The longer time of recovery is if the nerve has had significant damage and it could take a while to fully recover (which was my case).

Generally, the only time surgery is necessary is if numbness or loss of muscle use occurs due to the crushed nerve (I lost the ability to use my left tricep) or if the pain is excessive. New surgery techniques involve simply shaving the bulging part and sealing the disk to prevent further leakage of the fluid -- this is much less invasive and has a quicker recovery time; plus the vertebrae are not fused together. I had my the old fashioned surgery and two of my vertebrae are fused together using a portion of a thigh bone (you can choose to use your own or that of a cadaver -- I chose the cadaver method).

A herniated disk will generally show symptoms several hours after the injury (sometimes days) unless the injury was severe -- which does not appear to be the case with War Nerve. Although I am surprised you have not been to a neurosurgeon or neurologists.

 

Yeah - Massages, stretching, hot tubs / showers and the like are all decent for a temporary form of moderate relief, but it's back to reality a half-hour later. Though I'd still be up for a massage any old day of the week with or without the pain. Oh man...

Regarding a possible pinched nerve: I thought an MRI would show this as well? I feel no burning, shocking or piercing-type pains: Just a constant deep aching in my spine with constant cracking and popping which seems to inflame the surrounding muscles. As T2 said, it's probably not a herniated disc as it would have shown up in some of the tests done.

T2, after the recovery period of your surgery are you back to your normal self? Do you still feel pain?

A huge problem lies with the fact that the doctors can't find anything. There's apparently no red flag in the tests and scans to pinpoint a direct source or cause of pain, so all the recommendations and meds at this point from the docs have been educated guesses as to what might offer relief. I've even been prescribed arthritis and neuropathic pain meds like gabapentin just to see if they affect the pain.

I haven't been to a neurosurgeon yet because I'm still being passed around here and there it seems. One doctor tries some things for a few months, finds that it relieves my pain in no way, then I'm handed down the line when he feels like his options are exhausted. Maybe I'll end up at one eventually.

 

Have you tried painkillers called dihydrocodiene? My mum has rhumetoid arthritis in her spine and they work for her. They gave me them after my c-section as well and although the pain was still there, they're so strong, I didn't actually care

 

Well, my case was one of the 20% which does not immediately heal. Most of the pain went away (a had back spasms from the time of the injury to the surgery), but the numbness and use of my tricep took a couple of months. I still get aches in my left arm when a storm moves through -- so, no you don't go completely back to normal; but all the aches now are not constant and easily handled by ibuprofen.

My understanding of the cracking and popping is like when you crack your knuckles. The cracking or popping sound comes from the tendon being snapped from one place to another, in a manner similar to snapping your fingers (with the same basic sound). This may be what is happening in your back.

Normally I would say you need to exercise your back because your muscles are not able to maintain your spine in the proper form (that's why the tendons are shifting and you need to pop your back to get the tendons in the right spot); however, in your case I'm not sure -- it would really depend on how much you focused on your back while exercising (squats stress the back, but may not work it enough).

I used to have real problems with my back. I had constant discomfort and the popping/cracking you describe. This was really due to a lack of strength in my back (even though I didn't think it was an issue). After my surgery a friend (and now Mrs Bruno) helped me with an exercise regiment which slowly strengthed my back without stressing it. I've been feeling great for several years now.

 

Aww...that's so romantic

 

Yeah, I should have known I would be in for a lifetime of pain. She's an athlete and a very demanding strengthening coach. Although she has been a little easier on me since we had the little Brunos.

 

Romance don't cure pain, Silvery, but it does make it more livable

War Nerve, I feel for you. I'm a huge fan of western medicine but it has not found a way to deal with every single issue, especially regarding pain. I hope that in your quest you find some relief, as it must be very difficult to live like that.

 

Does Ibuproen/Brufen based medication help your pain?
If so the pain is based at least partially around muscle tension - as muscle tension is also a RESPONSE to pain a muscle relaxant of some sort on a regular basis can at least aid in the recovery. Muscles tense in a response to pain and encourages blood flow to the area which usually assists in healing - in many instances though the tension can cause its own trouble so alleving that for a while can be beneficial for a while.

Heat packs and sprays can be useful if the pain is more rheumatic or caused by the bits between the vertabrae and also 'distract' the nerves from the pain.

A sizable proportion of back pain continues AFTER the initial cause has long healed, in which case it's impossible to diagnose a ghost as it is the nerves becoming oversensitive to the reaction of muscle spasms and sensitivity in the bone after initial trauma.

Look into things like Glucosamine and Chondroitin as they are not medication - just suppliments that can assist in the reparation of cartilage and ligaments all over the body, and not all scans can pick up on minor damage on middle strength tissues (The equivalent of a papercut on a ligament for example. HURTS LIKE A *****)

Acupuncture is usually with a surprisingly high success rate with continuing back pain where the initial cause has healed. You may also want to invest in a TENS machine, it has been a godsend to me I can promise that much, however you may want to get a cheaper one from a standard chemist before looking into a prescribed one from a Pain Clinic or similar office as they do not work on all people, some people simply aren't receptive to the frequency or it may need to be altered for you.

Hope this helps in some way with ideas to try, can always try and think up more if you want to give me a challenge

 

Well, I've had hydrocodone which I'm assuming is similar (if not the same thing). The problem with painkillers is that they don't really address the problem: The hydrocodones I once took didn't relieve the pain itself, but rather gave a short state of euphoria. Like you said, they just cause you to cease caring. It was sort of a "My back still hurts, but that's ok because I love the world so much!!"-type of pain relief.

Very cool that you've worked it back into proper health with the help of the Mrs.

My back is in good shape from a strength perspective. I still continue to do seated low and high rows along with weighted pull-ups and lower back lifts, but exercise hasn't done a thing for the pain. It could very well be that some of the exercises have been causing more tension, though it's hard to detect because when I'm working out I hurt less.

Ibuprofen helps in no way, shape or form I'm afraid, and neither do heat / ice packs. Gabapentin was prescribed to me to test the phantom injury theory, yet it did nothing aside from giving me headaches and making me a complete bastard to be around.

The TENS machine didn't work for me either. They had a higher-powered version at the chiropractor as well as the PT office, and neither were effective in relief.

I've not tried Glucosamine / Chondroitin or acupuncture, so those could be options.

 

@Warnerve: Hmm, one possibility is that the cause might be your trigeminal nerve and facial muscle tension...

Often in the case of chronic pain the actual cause of the pain is somewhere else than where you actually feel the pain. Now that the TENS machine didn't work, it might suggest that the cause of the pain is somewhere else.

In the case of trigeminal nerve, it's your facial muscles that might cause the pain.

A problem with traditional western medicine is that it isn't exactly even possible to measure muscle tension. It's possible to notice, but it isn't one of those things that you'd just go and measure (although if there is a way to do it that is reliably used in medicine, then correct me if I'm wrong...)

The effect of acupuncture has more to do with it being relaxing, it's can be considered to have a bit of an extremely effective placebo effect. Usually, in the case of a statistically average human, the effect comes from it being very relaxing. The actual points where the needles are does not seem to make a difference according to (some?)western medical research.

The reason why I recommended tàijíquán was that it, as well as acupuncture has the same basic idea of using your body without "blocking the flow of chi" or "releasing the the flow of chi".

Now 'chi' doesn't have to be seen as some mystic religious mumbo-jumbo. Chi can be considered to be an umbrella term for many things concerning mainly kinetic energy and the use of force, and especially in chinese medicine the use of physical strength and muscles (among a lot of other things though).

That in mind, the basic idea has some merit. If your "chi" is blocked, or in other words if you have chronic hypertension of facial muscles somewhere, for instance in your face, it'll cause problems and pain in somewhere else in your body.

Weightlifting is a great excercise, but the isolation of separate muscles can cause hypertonia in isolated muscle groups even in those areas that you didn't select in your workout routine. As you know, in heavy lifting you also flex a lot of other muscles no matter how much you try to isolate the selected muscles and musclegroups in your workout routine.

Other opstions in hypertonus are nocturnal mastication, which is often noticed as a morning jaw pain, and can cause chronic muscle tension in the muscles of head, neck and upper back.

So the question is if you grit your teeth relatively often, or perhaps just chew on chewing gum often. If your chewing muscles aren't that tense, then the cause of the pain could be something else, but this is often overlooked by regular doctors and chiropracticians, and noticed more often by dentists.

Other causes of chronic back pain might vary from the way you walk (if for instance the other one of your legs might be even slightly shorter than the other), your posture (which has already been covered in here though), and your sleeping mattress.

When I had "chronic" back pain, the cause was that the mattress I was sleeping then was too soft, which allowed me to sleep with my back in a strange position...

 

One more thing War Nerve - are you going to really good doctor/hospital? I live in Maryland, and while my local doctor is fine if I get a cold or my gout flares up, if I had a more serious health issue - like when I first herniated a disk in my neck - I would go to Johns Hopkins in Baltimore. There are fine local doctors out there, but many lack th equipment and testing procedures available in top hospitals, and doctors in top hospitals also tend to see more people with rare conditions, and your chance of a successful diagnosis is much higher if you're going to a top notch facility.

Your personal info says you live in Texas. Big place. Are you by a major metroplitan area? Houston? Dallas/Ft. Worth? San Antonio maybe? I don't know where exactly you live in Texas, nor do I know how good the hospitals are in these cities. But going to a specialist - even if it requires some travel - would certainly be in your best interest.

 

I have two: #5 & #7. But they show up pretty well on an MRI. I've had them for years, and they give me chronic pain, but nothing I can't live with. They are especially painful after, yes, sex - figures. I don't exercise, unless you consider chasing three kids all over creation exercise. But I get a pretty good workout playing on my drums.

That's exactly what I take for my pain when it really flares up and it works pretty well. I know this isn't much help, WN, but I don't think your problem is the same. Sounds to me like you have something else.

 

I live in Amarillo which is in the northern TX Panhandle. The pop is near 200K, and the healthcare here is supposed to be decent. My tests were done at Baptist Saint Anthony's Hospital which is reputable, and the first ortho surgeon I went to, Dr. LaGrone, is apparently nationally recognized. I'm not sure exactly how well the others measured up, but they did seem to know their stuff. Except in my case, that is. A-hem.

To be honest, I'm not sure how willing I would be to travel. It would be a different scenario if I actually knew something could be done but despite the thousands I've spent on tests, doctor visits and meds, I'm still exactly where I was on day one. I fear that traveling abroad would be the same worthless money sink that everything else has been.

Right. I've done the Ibuprofen route, but it doesn't do a thing for me unfortunately.