Dealing with Davaeorn in a no-reload game

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After a long time I'm back in the BG-mood. While looking for a new twist, my eye caught the "no reload" idea doing the rounds on the boards recently. Being a heavy re-loader myself, I decided to have a go at it, and see if I could get through the whole game without dying once.

Here is the team I'm running with. I went for a small crew, as I want the levels to be high to increase my survival-chances:

Me: since death of the PC means end of game, I chose a Cleric. Clerics can be heavily protected while still being able to cast, giving a choice between frontline work in most fights, and back-end support when things get hot. All that healing and buffing is also pretty handy to have in a run like this. I went for an Elf with 19 DEX, to help out with the AC.

Kagain: The master of meat-shields. He runs in while the rest starts spraying arrows, bullets and magic. That re-gen and huge HP is great (and ofcourse he has the Gauntlets/DEX). Too bad about the alignment, but I can handle the low-rep costs in the shops, and the other team-members don't seem to mind his grumbling.

Imoen: My favorite Thief/Mage, and always a good addition in smaller teams. I dualed her at Level 5, and just got her up to Mage Level 6: that bow+1 is doing its job again. Her skills are only Detect Trap and Open Locks: no pickpocketing in this run, but that's no big loss (I just slashed Algeron when my rep went too high, and don't need to pickpocket any other stuff), and I'm no fan of trap-setting or backstabbing anyway.

Kivan: The archers rule BG, and Kivan rules the archers. He's responsible for 45% of all kills in the team. That is enough reason to be in. I did comtemplate trading him in for Coran, but just couldn't bear it, he's been too valuable up till now to just dump him.

That's the team I had planned, and I'm sticking to it: I have picked up some others at the start, but only as fodder: Monty, Xvar, Jahiera and Khalid all died valiantly while getting stuff like the Girdle of Piercing and Mirianne's Ring/Prot+1.

Up till now, things have gone smooth: everybody is level 6 or 7, Cloakwood has just opened up, and I have done just about all quests available up to this point. I have only had to Raise Dead twice: Kivan got creamed by the Sirines protecting the Tome/CON, and a wounded Imoen was critically hit by an arrow from a Black Talon Elite (I can assure you he paid in full for that one). Of all fights, those Sirines have been the biggest problem: other than that, I haven't been in any real danger.

I am however getting worried about Davaeorn. He has always been a cause of serious reloading for me, so I suspect he is the first real danger I am up against. Although I haven't yet reached him, I am seriously pondering on how to take him on.

Does anybody know of a low-risk strategy on how to get him down ? Remember, it's a "no-reload" game, so I prefer long, expensive but safe methods instead of quick-but-high-risk tactics.

Right now, I'm thinking about swamping him with summons to drain his magic; the good thing about that one is that I can probably flee if it doesn't work out, but I have no idea if it will work: usually, I just run in fully buffed, and reload if it goes wrong, but that is not an option..

 

It's an option for the NPCs... Anyway if you manage to disable the summoning traps you should be fine with the correct items.
Wands like wand of the Heavens can be useful for your PC.
My advice would be to use NPCs as decoys, the only problem is that the Archmage has a nasty habit of teleporting from one place to another... Just make sure your PC is safe and that the NPCs are on the frontline.
I would add a few decoys, like Coran and Yeslick. It wouldn't be that bad if they got slaughtered (and Yeslick could cure your Cleric if he got in too bad a shape, after all the PC is the only character you need to preserve).
Once Mr D. runs out of spell you can let the PC use his hammer or any other Cleric weapon to pummel him to death...
Of course that sort of tack could only be used by a NE PC.

 

Now would be a great time to add a few NPCs, since you're main 4 are already near their peak. I'd suggest as Caradhras already did: Coran and Yeslick.

Coran adds another archer, and you already said they rule this game. Yeslick adds more healing, and is a good melee tank, and you can never have too much of either, especially in a No Reloads game. Although I've heard that Yeslick and Kagain don't get along well at all, I've never tried it.

When you get to Daveron, have Imoen drink a potion of, or cast "Invisibility" and detect/disarm those traps. They're the worst part IMO. Summon a lot of monsters to help take D down, and good luck!

I usually have problems with him as well, and this strategy worked in my last no reloads game (side note:I just got out of the Underdark in SoA with my No Reloads game!!!).

 

Aye, I heard that they end up in a fight with each other. However, if you take Yeslick along as for as Davaeorn and then drop him after winning the fight, this shouldn't be a problem.

As for the fight itself, I'd do what Klorox and Caradhras suggested: summon loads to use up his spells. When he begins to run out, rush him with everyone.

 

I like the way you guys are reasoning. Here is the tactic I am thinking about in full (I'm not there yet, so still time to tweak):

Imoen will take out the traps, so those are no longer an issue.

I've got a bunch of Potions of Absorption lying around (100% elec-resistance), so the main crew all take one to prevent surprises from rogue lightning.

The main team stays in the starting area: I have never seen Davaeorn pop up there, so they should be save.

I send in the skeletons: those 5 or 6 Raised Deads should be a great way to draw his magic out. Sending along an invisible Coran so I can guide them, and hasting them so they can run after him when he Ports seem like nice options.

If they go down while he isn't drained yet, I pump in a bunch of low-level summons, just to clean up. Sending along Yeslick if Coran somehow valiantly died seems good: maybe he can pull off his Dispel Magic for some added help. He'll probably die valiantly right after, but that's ok.

If it is clear that Davaeorn is running on empty (if not, I can still get out), I buff up the main team, and run in to finish him off, claiming Victory in a Bold and Perilous Fight! Ha!

(Hey, I'm True Neutral, so as long as others are doing it, everything goes in my book. Besides, NPCs shouldn't complain when they valiantly die: they are supposedly heroes, and should be thrilled at the opportunity..)

Klorox, your remark makes me think about extending the group: I like the combination I have right now, but adding Coran permanently might be a good move. I'm not going for 6, that's just way to much for me, but having another arrow-cannon can be nice now that experience is starting to be less important. Note that I have already completed the wyvern-quest; I suspect that will not be an issue ?

 

Wrong. There's a Glyph of Warding trap that cannot be seen or disarmed, due to a missing flag that makes it not count as a trap. And even if Baldurdash or whatever does fix this, the difficulty is set at 90, so I doubt Imoen will have the skill. My suggestion is to disarm the first three traps (the two Battle Horror appearances and a Skull Trap) and then send a gnoll or something to soak up the remaining two (both Glyphs of Warding), because the undetectable one is just before the last trap and you don't want Imoen to set it off when trying to disarm the last trap. And of course, if it only sets off one of the Glyphs of Warding, you can send Imoen to check if the remaining trap is detectable. In the unlikely event that it sets off both but is killed by the first one and the second doesn't detonate...there goes another gnoll.

I wouldn't guarantee that. The number of things I've heard about Coran acting screwy...well, let's just say that if I'm going to take Coran I always do it in the linear way that I know works (pick up Coran, then go to cave and kill wyverns). But at the very least you'll have him for 16 days of game time (probably cut down a bit by the Cloakwood travel times), and you may even get lucky and have him stick around. Just to be sure, though, I'd pop in the wyvern cave for a few seconds when you're on the way to the mines.

 

Thanks Fel, that explains why I always get hit at the start of this battle: I presumed it was Davaeorn doing some clever casting, but it is probably the glyph..

I'll send in some simple spawn before the skeletons; the survivors of the glyph(s) can have their 5 seconds of fame by drawing the first hits from Mr D.

Imoen's Find Trap is at 90, but I'll bring along that Potion of Power from storage, just to be save.

As for Coran, I'll let his erratic behaviour decide if he wants to stay with the team. I'm at the Friendly Arm right now, recuperating from doing Cloakwood and the Mine-entrance, so I'll pick him up immediately, and will do some sightseeing at the cave on the way. He just won't get any really important gear the first 16 days.

Also, Yeslick can supervise the dead guys instead of Coran. I can always send Coran as a follow-up, but this way, having to raise Coran becomes less likely. And Yeslick gets the chance to die valiantly trying to avenge his captors. I'm sure he'll love me for that.

 

In that case, I strongly suggest you skip Durlag's Tower. Well, you can do the upper floors, but I would advise against going into the basement. There are more than a few 90+ skill traps down there.

 

Unbelievable. Davaeorn got killed by a fluke.

I just completed the Mine. Not wanting to get into trouble with Mr D, I decided to clear the whole Mine first, and then recuperate and gear up for him back at the Inn.

At the last moment I make a small change to the plan (yes, I know, always a bad idea..). I go down, just to take out the first guard and let Imoen handle the first traps. I can always run out after that, right ?

So that's what I do: Imoen clears the traps, Mr D sees her, he starts his "I'm bad, you're dead"-speech, and we all run up the stairs. End of story, right ?

Wrong. While the team is lumbering around in the small stairway of the previous level, Mr D suddenly also pops up! And he is blocking the doorway, making it impossible for me to leave: sounds like end of game to me..

Wrong again. Instead of unleashing the gates of hell on me, Mr D thinks it is a better idea to start poking his stick at Kagain. Yes, that's right, he does no casting at all! He just stands there, swinging his crummy staff in the general direction of Kagain's armor.

His protections were up, so it took me a while to take him down (elemental stuff seems to work), but since he was wasting his time trying to rumble with Kagain, he went down easily.

I have no idea if this is normal behaviour for him, but if so, then I just found a save (if somewhat cheesy) way of getting rid of him..

Too bad I couldn't try out the tactic: I'll be sure to give that one a go in a later run, though.

 

When you change areas in the middle of a fight some weird things can happen... I guess if your party hadn't ran away and stayed to confront Mr D. things would have been quite different (lightning bolts for instance, very nasty when playing a low level party crowded in a small room).

 

Wow, that's a great one, Har!

 

This is not my experience. I just did Davaeorn with Imoen at 80% find traps. She disabled all 4 traps, and I didn't get hit any other trap. I am baldurdashed, but nothing else.

As to Davaeorn himself - I think he's pretty easy compared to level 2 of the mines. All you need to do is hit him with one dispel magic and he's toast. (Arrows of biting, darts of wounding, etc.) The problem is not to dispel when he's teleporting around. I summon monsters, and spread the group out in the middle. The monsters head up all 3 hallways, so one of them will get his dire charm. As soon as he casts something that isn't dimension door I hit him with a couple of dispels (Yeslick's is great as it casts very quickly).

In no reloads I would protect my PC with mirror image or potion of absorption in case he gets off his lightning bolt. But it's not his first cast after all the dimension doors so it's unlikely he'll be able to cast lightning bolt.

 

There are five traps: A Skull Trap, two Battle Horror spawning traps, and two Glyph of Warding traps. By what you say I'd guess either Baldurdash just removes the undetectable GoW, or you got lucky in not setting it off.

 

I have found that if you are wearing the boots of speed you can run over a trap and not set it off or if you do yo can out run the area of affect.

 

Hey, I just met him again, so it's fresh... Here's the foolproof and non-cheesy way to deal with the wizard.

It's definitely cheesy to slay him thanks to a script problem (i.e. he attacks with his staff or something like that).

In my baldurdashed version, you can disarm all the traps before you face Davaeorn.

After his speech, Davaeorn teleports in the side room. If your players are in sight of him, lightning bolt is his first spell, then he teleports. If you're not in sight, he comes closer to you, then teleports again, and then comes for you. But he'll not cast any bolts, which must be a script issue.

I think that if you don't want to be cheap, you must take his first bolt with a NPC (just move quickly to avoid rebounds).

Then he'll cast dire charm (twice sometimes), then mirror image, then hold (twice sometimes), then summon monsters 3.

You can charm back your dire charmed players. For example, Jaheira had 2 charm spells memorised and Xan one, which was enough.

I had just recruited Yeslick to replace Branwen. His special ability "dispel magic" cancels Davaeorn's defences, as well as his charm or hold spells.
The best time is before the villain casts 'monsters summoning 3', especially if you have held heroes, but even after that, it's OK.

If he gets the chance, he'll immediately cast mirror image, so use your arrows of biting. He's then toast, like ister says.

I've reloaded several times and it always worked.

Strange things:
-Even though his protection from normal missiles still seems on after dispel, it's not.

-Davaeorn seems to be totally immune to fire; he seems immune to 'hold' as well

-He has very good saves so you shouldn't count on a spell like 'command word: die' (though I saw it work once)

-When he's subject to magical 'horror', he'll teleport again and again: seems he has an infinite reserve of 'dimension door' spells...

@Har: Dex 19 or 20 is the same as 18 for the AC bonus

[ January 09, 2007, 23:02: Message edited by: Capt Massacre ]

 

I'd be careful about about charming back dire charmed party members, there are many threads about how it ruined the rest of the game.

 

Yes, I checked those threads, there could be a bug in the game?
In my game, it works in this way when you charm back a dire charmed hero: He's green, and he gets another 'charm' symbol on his portrait, beside the 'dire charm'.
Then the latter symbol disappears (the counter charm), but the hero remains green.
Then the dire charm disappears, and the hero's still green. So I have no problem whatsoever.


But note that Yeslick's dispel should dispel all charms. At least, it does that in my game. It dispels everything.

Now if every game reacts in a different way, that becomes harder...


Edit:
While trying different tactics, I got a rather cheesy one as well: your thief steals toward him to locate him. He does his speech although he doesn't see you, in a typical BG1 way, then waits. Yeslick casts his dispel magic not far from him and he's toast for backstabbing and arrows of biting.

[ January 03, 2007, 21:20: Message edited by: Capt Massacre ]

 

I found him rather weak. After all the talk here I was expecting a tough mage fight, but...

Immy disarmed the traps, so there were no GoWs or Battle Horrors. And Davaeorn is pathetic when he is alone. My NPCs, using oil of speed, quickly dispelled his mirror images. He was able to summon monsters (dire wolves!) once but my conjurer PC managed to put them to sleep. He DDed around but my characters followed and punished him with lightning speedç And he died then, Minsc ran through his sorry hide with Spider's Bane+2. And my PC plus Eldoth (newly found and really liked his style, can use bows, can cast spells and identify things!) leveled up at the same time too! Cool!

 

Well, we're not used to the uber-hard opponents that you are.

 

Well I take it as a compliment, thank you! Though I have to agree that, those battle horrors are very tough! Had to reload once due to them, and after disarming the traps, the mage guy is simple.

I liked the massive fight at the Iron Throne! A lot! That is one cool, gigantic battle with worthy opponents out for your blood! Luckily my conjurer had fourth lvl spells to turn the tides just then:summoned army of hobgoblins, confusion, and spamming fireballs (me from spells, Eldoth from the so many wands) did the trick nicely!

I love this game! Had to quit in the catacombs beneath Candlekeep. Hope there is still time for returning to BG for unfinished bussines, also I need to buy robe of the good arch-magi, I finally have the wealth. I can return back to BG or High Edge before the game finishes, right? Pleaaase?