The point of no return

Remove all ads!

As a DM, like most others i try to find what is, and what isn't best for my party.
Does anyone have views on how to treat your party and what bad treatment u give out to it?.
As one of many groups within my city i see myself as one of the better DM's (Lord help us all) and i have sat and watched a max lvl 3 party be torn apart by a band of Minotours!, what advantage did this give the DM?, atleast his group now know he can kill them if they ruin his story.

Yet i still have the problem of compremise, do i lay the hurt, or do i let them walk the mission?, any anvice?

 

The only useful advice that I can give to you is that this game is designed to be fun. As a DM it is your job to facilitate the enjoyment. The players usually do not enjoy being killed, and will resent being killed off if the reason is that the DM was not prepared for their actions. (ie: they ruined the plot) If you are the only DM around, they may stay with you, but will opt out at the first opportunity. Also, as the DM, it is you who designed the adventure. If you send the players up against creatures that are too strong for them to handle, they will not enjoy that either. The key is to challenge them without killing them. They should get hurt, but not die. This is of course just my opinion.

 

On the other hand, if they know you won't kill them, there's no fear of death; this reduces enjoyment too. It's a fine line to walk sometimes. I had a DM who had a problem with making things too challenging; then, to avoid killing us, he would bail us out somehow. That's not bad once or twice, but when it becomes the DM saving your butt instead of you saving it, kinda takes away from the game.

Basically, stupid actions should be punished, with due consideration of course.

 

Basically, a DM should always have more than one option available. 3 or 4 would be even better. Try to guess every possible action that could be taken, and set up skeleton (ie, preliminary) scenarios for every path that could be chosen. A good DM is never caught off guard by a players inspiration. Flexibility is key.

I'd hate to be bailed out by my DM. If my own actions get me dead, then hey, that's my own fault. Especially if I'm making decisions based on having a few different options to choose from. Just tonight, my PC spent 3 days wandering around the damn forest, getting further and further from town, while my DM was laughing his ass off. *sigh* But I still stayed alive, and most importantly, out of trouble, and eventually found my own way home. (With a handy little map I was able to scratch out by virtue of my not-so-aimless wanderings, and the promise of going back to explore all the interesting sights I ran from the first time. *g*).

If he had bailed me out after my first night in the woods, I'd have been disappointed. I want to get there on my own, thank you.

 

But I think a good point to make is there is always the possibility of death in any well balanced fight. A DM doesn'g have to flex his muscle to prove he can kill a player just to increase the excitement for the others. I think DM's should, as Darien said, really think hard about everything a player might do, and have some restrictions in place to prevent players from doing somethig a DM really doesn't want them to do. If you don't want them wandering in that direction yet, put something there that will turn them around. A players actions should have consequences, and if a careless player dies, well, he dies. I don't think a DM should continuously bail players out, but then I think he should set up scenarios where he doesn't continuously need to. Carefully consider everything before you send players out into your world. I think the best DM is one who has a well thought out plan from beginning to end, and has enough flexibility in his game to see both him and his players through to it's conslusion.

 

As far as I see it you could od whatever you want. If they encouter something you as a DM know they cant kill, dont attack with the creature, instead look and see what happens, if the players attack and discover that they can't kill it, either make them surrender or die in the glory of combat.
OK, the players are the HERO's in the game, but that doesnt mean that they can travel around the world and kill everything. Mayby the players are powerfull, but there are always someone who is even more powerfull. "Without evil there can't be no good"
So in the end, I think you should let them encounter something they can't beat once in a while,not in combat atleast, let them deal with the creature in some other way.

 

I did not mean to imply that you do not kill off the players if they are stupid. That goes without saying. The DM should not bail out the characters. He should however try to design the adventure and encounters to be challenging without being too much for them to handle.

 

I think Baldak Oakfist about sumed it up. The DM's job is to keep the game fun. Let the players know they might die but you are not trying to kill them off. This is not you 'goal' as DM, and the players should not perceive it as so. The stupid rule is the DM's best friend. Don't be afraid to kill of players who are being stupid.
That is the time in my games when most PCs die. If a PC trying to be 'extra' heroic then they are running an increased risk of danger. Maybe a big payoff or maybe death. The risk must equal the rewards. Sometime thing work out and they are a hero sometime they don't and they are a bloody mess. But if they are being just stupid then the gloves are off. Give them a warning but if they don't listen let them pay the price for their actions.


[This message has been edited by Voltric (edited October 24, 2001).]

 

Indeed, when the party does something wrong, punish them but don't kill them. A good father punishes his son Keep them alive though, when things go very wrong, sometimes a mysterious saviour can show up.

 

Ok, thanx for the advice guys, it has been a great help.

 

Crawl, that's pretty much what I was trying to get at. I agree completely with you.

 

In my campaign, we have a few players who believe that they are the invincible heroes and that what the heck the DM wouldnt send some creatures that could kill us. That is one of the reasons I took over for our last DM, he was to bloody kind.
So now they face a new and real threat, and that is me
I told them from the start that I will not show any mercy for your actions like the last DM. The first thing that happens is that nearly everybody dies, only one died though, but almost everybody was below 0 Hp at one point I think.
Just let them now that every hero can meet his undoing at any time. I will not be so kind with Raise deads either, if a evil character comes to a good cleric and wants him to raise his evil partner, neither the cleric nor the God will raise him. If they should be raised the should have earned the favor of the Gods, either by fighting evil in the name of that God, or by some other reasons.
But again thats only me, and my style of DMing

 

I agree with you on the rasie dead issue to a degree. But afterall there are church and clerics of all faiths and beliefs; evil, good choatic and lawful. It shouldn't be that hard to find someone who would raise a character if the coin is there. I think saying the 'Gods' oppose you being raise is not really fair.

I do agree that a good cleric or church wouldn't raise an evil character no matter how much gold they were offered, but that's not the only option.

And as I said before the DM shouldn't be out to kill the players but don't getting them think you won't kill them if it comes to it. By all means don't 'save' them if they are loosing. That get real cheezie fast. Let them face the reality that there are stonger forces in the world they need to respect.