Wish list

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...maybe some short interference in the gray wastes, some xp collecting in the blood war ?

a third party comes in between the baatezu & the tanar'ri, hacking behind their backs, heh

...what to say...i just love the planes...

 

If NWN was so bad, why did is sell so good, and is stil for sale? It must have a lot of fans, like me, to have a large community and mods. Is it that bad come on, I understand that bg2 was better but that game is followed by bg3(Other topic so post there if you want to speak about bg3) This game is NNW2, so it will look alot like nwn1 period accept it

The wish list is as good as complete. we all agree on some things that are important and true to 3.5(not going to debate those)

most will not reach the game thankfully but if I choose the the top FIVE (NOT MORE BUT FIVE)it will look like this:

1 party based
2 true non extra balanced 3.5.
3 different plot paths/text according to alignment/class/sex/race
4 character customization class/look
5 real money/items balance

is that is possible, and done, let the rest just go to save time and pick some up whit expansions.

 

If Neverwinter Nights is played how it is meant to be (player-DM, a number of PCs in a custom module) then it's brilliant! It gives people the chance to play D&D (obviously not totally faithful to the tabletop for balance purposes) without having all the books, dice, models and/or whatever.
However, the single player of the game was dissappointing. NPC interaction was extremely limited, right down to the fact that you were only allowed one to follow you. It wasn't what a lot of fans were expecting when compared with other CRPGs.
Having said that, I do like the game - if you forgive the abysmal models on some of the monsters, you can get very immersed indeed, especially if you play the persistent world roleplaying servers, heh.

 

More diversity would be great (different paths, sub-races) but i think the ppl makin NWN2 are too focus on graphics to really add so many areas to explore and stuff. Anyway i want alot of fighting with human mages, fighters, and stuff. IWD 1/2 was really missin that and there was nothing too special in NWN .

 

Randomness. This sort of game would be more replayable if there was more randomness in the monsters encountered and treasure uncovered. It would be cool if you didn't know exactly what sort of monster was going to be in the next room or exactly what sort of magic weapon you were going to find.

 

Try World of Warcraft instead then.

 

I agree to this thing someone said above: one shouldn't be able to single-handedly kill a dragon. They are the mightiest creatures in the Realms, and even high-level groups should have challenge overcoming them. Thus they shouldn't pop up around every corner, either.

Money should take space from your inventory, like in good ol' Diablo. Who carries 2,000,000 gold pieces in his backpack alone? Naturally, those gold pieces should also add weight.

Also, trading items with merchants would be a good idea. Sure it can be done so that you, for example, first sell a sword and buy a new one. But in real life, you'd probably offer the sword and gold/other items, depending how much they're worth.

 

Well the mighiest adventurers can slay dragons by themselves (Elminister). Not Drizzt or Artemis though since they're like lvl 16 by BG2 standards when Elminster is lvl 30.

 

I love the way this is done in Morrowind. It would be great if they could make a system like that - much more realistic!

 

well if they would just start with the copper, silver, gold and platina coins to start. then make sure that you always are in need of money. really avoid the 100.000 gold pieces situations.

Morrowind has also many holes in the money system. Like this: get one expensive item. sell it and buy all the merchant stuff. putt in on the ground and come back a day later. the merchant will have new money and your items are still on the floor. Or sell the gems after the soul feeding spell. No not the morrowind way. just temper the prices and make gold weigh.

 

Well as one who has played BG2 many years and who really enjoyed ToEE (even though it's not FR ) I have a couple of opinions, I will also put what game they stem from in brackets.

1) I would prefer an initiative and turn based combat system. That works much better in my opinion rather than pause-play-pause-play [ToEE]

2) More side quests, I didn't really like the way Chapters in NWN removed you from previous areas. I really liked the way you could go back and forth in BG2. If there is a huge city in the game, there should be alot to do and I should be able to return several times throughout the game [BG2]

3) Party based, party based, and party based. That is D&D at its core. No one character of any class is going to be very useful without tons of equipment and magical items which is very unlikely for any starting character. [BG2,ToEE]

4) I really liked the idea of a much more advanced combat/interaction system such as in ToEE. Being able to decide to make a 5-foot step and also being able to charge/coup de grace/disarm was excellent. Why does everyone forget Bull Rush and Sunder though? [ToEE]

5) Wizards. Ok, some applies to sorcerers but specifically wizards. As NPCs they should either be studying/looking for/trying to buy/trying to sell spells/items/potions. Also, I actually miss the feeling of being terrified of finding a mage like in BG2. If they are travelling around they should have many protective spells memorized as well as a few scrolls and potions to help them out, usually with some melee guards/hirelings. USUALLY you would meet them in their stronghold where highpowered wizards can both be very useful and very deadly, as they will have access to all their various items and defenses. I also agree about the spellbooks, they should both be an item you have as well as an item that wizards have. Most wizards would probably not be carrying their main spellbook around with them, that would be in their stronghold (see above). Lastly, item creation for me was crucial in my enjoyment of ToEE. Even though I hated the level 10 cap (more on this later) I really enjoyed the ability that wizards/clerics/etc SHOULD HAVE to make magic items. How do you think that magic items show up in the game? They weren't scattered about by the gods to play with the mortals, people make and sell them. Studying/Scribing scrolls and item creation is wizards' and their apprentices' vocation [ToEE, BG2]

6) I would LOVE to see some Faerun PrC, especially archmage, but if that is not possible, it would at least be very awesome to have the means without alot of 2da editing to add new classes so that the community (which the developers obviously know is going to happen anyway) will have a modular way to add classes. [NEW!]

7) More involved NPC communication. Romances/banter/arguments are very nice ways for players to get interested in the story. Heck, I could easily have made a killer party out of my own rolled up characters in BG2 which would have been much more effective, but having the ones designed were so much more rewarding to the overall experience. [BG2]

8) More character variance. Please for the love of god give us more variety in appearance than NWN did. I have to say looking at my ToEE and BG2 characters are much less painful than seeing the same random 12 guys in EVERY AREA of NWN. If NWN had a major weakness, poor character variance was it. I would rather have a more advanced character design engine from which NPCs could be made to be unique rather than have unique NPC meshes that the community will just have to hack later on in order to get more variety to the heads/hairs/bodies etc. Morrowind did a fairly good job of this. However, that doesn't mean whe don't like cool baddie meshes either (ala the Darth's in Kot0R 1 and 2) [ALL]

9) Templates. Templates. Please god give us templates, it is one of the things that made 3.5 cool. I would love to be able to play a character who is a lich/werewolf/vampire/celestial etc. Not only that, but it makes race creation so much easier for the community, so that out of the gobs of templates out there of which there is no way to add all of them can be added by people who want them. I daresay that all the base Faerunian classes should be there, such as Drow/Moon/Sun/Wild/Wood elves, Grey/Gold/Shield Dwarves, Ghostwise/Strongheart Halflings etc etc. There are 2 options to this, the morrowind method which was have several different races that come with their own style of faces/hairstyles or the Bg2/NWN method which is take a body mesh, head mesh and then just make them the right colors yourself. Either way would be great. [Bg2, Morrowind]

10) Since I have already seen from preview articles, "Neverwinter Nights includes ten support characters, of which you can take three into battle." Now what I'm afraid/sure this means is that ala Knights of the Old Republic, there are static slots which speicfic NPCs fill, meaning a) there is no way to create our own NPCs without overwriting other slots just like I had to for my Mod to Kot0R; and b) The character selection menu sucks. I'm pretty sure from this description this is exactly the case and my only wish is that it wasn't so, even though I'm sure that won't be fufilled

{I tried to keep this 10, oh well}

11) More NPC classes for module creators. I NEVER want to have to see a town comprised of level 10 fighters. That is so retarded, not even in the overpowered (according to some) world of Faerun does any town teem with level 10 fighters. Levels 1-5 Commoners, Adepts and Warriors and Aristocrats make up the base populus, as well as a few character class 1-5 Fighters and Priests for the More important/famous/powerful characters in the town, as well as your occasional Wizard who is either visiting on business ala Red Wizards or in his/her tower. Maybe one or 2 characters in a town break the 10 level mark. In cities like Waterdeep of course you have many more of the latter, but you have many,many,many,many MANY more of the former as well. Base populations should never be character classes. NWN did a decent job with the commoner class, but I'd like to see more for us "purist" module designers

12) Cap out levels so that people can at least get to a few epic levels (25-30 at least). NWN was ok with a level 20 cap but why stop there? Also item level restrictions? That is a stupid idea. How about high level items are hard to get. Of course cheaters will get them but cheaters will also bypass stupid level restrictions. Just stick to the D&D rules. If a level 1 rogue wants to run around with tons of rings/amulets etc let them die to goblins and let the next party meet up with some very powerful goblins haha.

13) Encounters and XP system in 3.5 works great, so why mess with it? If the party is 20th level but fighting goblins, ok sure there are alot, but that's no reason that if some idiot 1st level character comes across a dragon that he should be easier to kill. Big monsters should be treated like important NPCs and if the party is too weak well...try again. If you managed to sneak your way past all the early encounters only to come across the boss/leader whatever and not be able to beat them well...obviously your strategy did not work. However, since usually for SP games there will be no DM making sure the party is headed for adventures of the right difficulty, having NPCs either hint or downright refuse help from characters who wouldn't make it would be a big bonus. I wouldn't want to have the first quest be to save a keep from 30 trolls (*ahem* *cough* de Arnisse Hold in Bg2 *cough* ). Also having NPCS run up and accost the players are ok but make sure that the urgency of the issue is realistic. It is no fun for the game to shove every quest in your face immediately as direly urgent, since there is no way for the players to instantly solve them all. Any truly time-dependent quests should be stated as such and those who can be slipped back should ideally be also expressed as such.

14) The Church! Yes, I think that Helm should NOT be the only temple in every city, nor any other god for that matter. How about like BG2 where there are several temples? Sure Helm, Torm, Tyr, Tempus etc are great, but how about some evil ones as well (not in towns obviously). I'd like to see some less-oft used ones appear such as Kelemvor who is actually pretty important although totally neglected in NWN and only mentioned once in BG2 as a shrine to my knowledge. The people in Faerun are closely tied to the gods they worship, so they should be more than an afterthought in any game set in them. I would almost see them more akin to Jedi/Sith in Kot0R than as they appear in NWN. Also, they serve as great quest-givers to NPCs of the correct alignment, as long as those donations keep coming! [BG2, ToEE]

15) Speaking of evil, how about a campaign that evil characters can sucessfully complete with deciding to be good for awhile? After Kot0R 1 and 2 we KNOW that they are capable of doing this...

16) Finally, how about a good game? That's simple enough right

 

Excellent post there. Some great points

One thing though, NWN is designed to be very multiplayer friendly. I can't imagin a turn-based game been multiplayer friendly. Prehaps if there is an option to activiate turn based play?

 

Good points there. If I could only have three improvements from NWN, they would be:

1) Better and more interesting NPCs
2) Less boring and repetitive (see the OC)
3) More races and deities (like in IWD2)

 

Rotku I do agree with that, and although ToEE had MP support at one point that wasn't added at production time I can see that being a problem. I also realize that there is about a 0% chance this game will be turn based, but I just think that it greatly enhanced my D&D-in-a-game experience. However, that is a much more narrow audience than Obsidian is trying to reach

 

How about some reasonable implementation of rest periods? It is kind of unrealistic that you are able to instantly rest and recover all your spells.

 

In the premium mod shadow gaurd you needed rations, so that base is partly covered. it is meager, but still a start.

 

I have to say that I actually enjoy not having direct control over my henchmen/party members. It feels more like playing a leader of a party who issues commands that may or may not be obeyed rather than an omnipotent overseer who controls everything. Of course, this needs to be implemented well, but I hope it is retained in NWN2.

I also like to feel that I have earned what I recieve. I would like magic items to be rare, forged items to be expensive and multiclassing to be regulated. The latter could be hard to implement well, though, so I would think that free base class multiclassing and quest earned prestige classes would be more realistic to ask for.

 

I agree with Will re henchmen. BGII-style NPC are not really NPCs at all because you control everything they do. NWN henchmen are better because they do their own thing and you have to live with it.

 

But makes the hencman useless. most part you just solo in NWN. And that is not how the game is meant! And never must it be done like that. It was the biggest flaw in NWN. BG2 is BG2 because you could steer the hencman. Why not let the Hencman level fixed on preset paths?

Many people forget that BG2 was 2 ed rules. The leveling with 3.5 makes it a whole other game.

Has anyone tried icewind gate? It is a mod to play bg2 with the icewind dale 2 engine and 3.5 ruleset. It looks like bg2, it smells like bg2 but it is Icewind dale2. It has no bg2 feeling.(On the pocketplane site)

So we can all sob and say we want it like bg2 but we cannot. All we can is learn from it.

 

The henchman thing is only faulty in the original campaign where the henchmen were all stupid. It works fine in Shadows of Undrentide and Hordes of the Underdark because the AI is smarter there. Clearly, to have a non-controllable NPC only works if the technology is advanced enough. Which it is now.

So we no longer need to have NPCs which the player controls and should now have real NPCs that do their own thing. In other words, we need more Deekins.