Looking for rogue tips

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I just ordered the 3-in-1 box set and hopefully should get it in a few days. I'm wanting to make a rogue heavy character and I'm trying to get some general build tips cause I can't seem to find any. So I'm wondering if I should either:

fighter 4/ rogue X
ranger 1/ rogue X
or
straight rogue

Anyways, any suggestions would be greatly appreciated on this as well as race choice and anything else. I'm looking to make him primarily a sneakster/backstabber. Thanks

 

It sounds like you ordered the set with Icewind Dale, Heart of Winter, and Icewind Dale II.

Icewind Dale and its add on, Heart of Winter, use the AD&D second generation rules. Icewind Dale II uses third generation rules. You will have a completely different playing experience with the two rule sets. Before playing either be sure you understand the rule set you are using.

One thing in common with both games is you generate an entire party instead of just one character (at least I would recommend a large party the first time through). Both games are very combat oriented and neither requires a dedicated thief. In Icewind Dale (and Heart of Winter) I used a multiclassed fighter/thief (progresses in both classes at the same time). In Icewind Dale II I had a ranger/thief and kept the levels about the same in both classes.

 

Thanks for the response. Yea I'm more or less familiar with both rule sets from playing BG1 and 2 as well as playing NWN 1 and 2. Yea I was thinking halfling fighter/thief for IWD1 and its expansions. What should my stat array be ya think? I've also read that the thieves/rogues have sneak attack AND backstab. Whats the difference and which should I be using?

For IWD2 I was thinking of doing the ranger/rogue as well. Do you recommend keeping their levels around the same or could I just go with a few levels of ranger and the rest rogue? Curious, what race did you choose?

Thanks for help bud, I appreciate it.

 

Backstab is second edition rules, ie. IWD. Sneak attack is third edition, ie. IWD2.

Backstab can only be done from stealth and does huge damage in higher levels, while Sneak attack only requires that you can flank your opponent but does considerably less damage. A 30th level rogue can get 15d6 sneak attacks that barely dent HOF mode monsters.

 

As far as IWD1 is concerned;

Depends on the size of your team in IWD1 I played with a party of 2,
FMT totally owned, uber fighter(stoneskin/mirrorimage/blur/haste), good thief and competent mage, if your party is going to be bigger than 3, I guess you'd rather want a twoclassed char, like F/T or M/T. F/T is almost as good fighter as regular fighter but it has backstab and can disarm/open locks. M/T; you can do it two ways; make dual class and go mage when you got around 100% in traps and picklocks for basic theif skills. Or you can go mc M/T for more complete thief but you reach lower level in mage. If you haven't dualclassed yet maybe multiclass will be better for you. Are you familiar with dualclassing rules?

stats for F/T would be 18/00 (but 18/50 and + is solid) 18 18 smth smth smth
or Elf then you get 19dex but 17con it's not a big diff in a long run though
for any thief mage hybrid; 18 18 16* 18 smth smth, basically besides str dex and con maxed you need maxed int, what's left pump in wis and cha, you only need 1 character in your team with high CHA. No warrior classes dont get any bonus from con higher than 16, so for MT it makes sense to make it 16; for FMT you could set it to 18.

 

Hey guys, thanks for the replies. I definitely wanted to play through IWD, HoW, and TotLM first. I figured I would go with an elven or halfling F/T or human dual class F/T. Which do you think would be better? And if I go dual class, what level should I switch to thief? 4? At any rate I leaning towards multi class I think. I'm not a huge of fan of dual class but honestly I haven't use it much so there ya go. Thanks again, looking forward to playing this again. I have to admit in many ways I really love old 2nd rules. Ahh good times.

 

I'm not sure what would be better because I haven't played a dual thief in iwd, depends how much of a thief you'd want it to be. If you want a complete thief go for mc F/T if you want warrior with basic thief skills(i'd pump 100% in traps and picklocks, nothing in else) then dual. Dunno which level that would be. If I were too chose I'd take half elf or elf(don't like small races<racism>) mc F/T because it's solid throughout the game, is a both good warrior and a good thief and a backstabbing beast . Imo mc F/T would be more fun with more complete skills. If you plan to take mc characters id rather take smaller party, like 5-4 characters instead of full 6, but again im a fan of small parties.

 

The advantage of dual classed is *** in bows and *** in your backstabbing weapon. Having +3 damage and +3 to hit is really good. With a bow your thief becomes a very effective sniper but is limited in the "to hit" category. Dual at 7th level to gain the extra half attack per round and proficiency point.

A multiclassed character can only get ** in any weapon (+1 to hit, +2 damage) but continues to gain fighter levels (which adds +1 to hit for every level) -- so it doesn't take long for the multiclassed character to be hitting more often. The elf has a nice bonus to both swords and bows so makes an excellent sniping thief (along with backstabbing). The halfling is a better all around thief (and gets bonuses with slings). A couple of other advantages for the halfling is the Helm of the Trusted Defender (only usable by halflings/gnomes) and +1 to hit with thrown weapons (there is a magic throwing axe which is awesome but easy to miss).

I like all three choices but prefer a halfling -- especially in IWD.

As someone has already said, the M/T is also quite fun -- as is the C/T (I'm not sure if IWD lets you backstab with a staff though).

The best characters to dual in IWD are a mage and a druid. Having a few extra hitpoints for your mage is a good thing (dualing at 4th level is fine). The druid has such a odd experience point progression that you can actually obtain 9 levels in fighter, then dual and hit 11th level druid before you would have received 10th level fighter. This makes for a very powerful druid (choose your weapons carefully as a fighter).

My ranger rogue was human. I kept the levels about the same to keep the attack bonuses as high as possible, I did lose out on some sneak attack capability but hit more often. I took ranger to see how the class developed but I think fighter would be more powerful. My favorite character in IWDII was a Tiefling Monk, although the half-orc barbarian/cleric was cool too.

 

In IWD1 pure class thieves are weak. I don't recommend a dualclassed thief, either the benefit from the first class will be too low or you'll spend most of the game without a thief. As multiclass you keep gaining additional benefits from the other class.

For backstabbing you'll want both 18/00 strength and weapon specialization (so you can hit and do damage when you hit), so multiclass with fighter. I don't recommend halfling since you won't find an item which sets strength to a high value before late in the game, +2 to hit and +5 to damage do make a big difference. I'd create a good aligned gnome (racial saving throw bonuses !) fighter/thief with 18/00 strength, 18 dex and 18 con, other stats don't matter.
You can only backstab with thief weapons. Specialize in bows for ranged and large sword for melee, add short sword, dagger or club later.


In IWD2 rules are different. You can sneak attack with any weapon, the most destructive rogue is half-orc with starting stats (str-dex-con-int-wis-cha) 20-18-18-14-3-1 who raises only strength at level up. You can take one barbarian level after the first so you don't have to take feats for using the biggest 2-handed weapons effectively.

 

yeap bow + large sword + club tbh short sword/dagger can wait

 

Sweet guys. Thanks again and again. Okay so I should definitely use a long sword as opposed to a short sword for backstabbing? Also should I be using backstabs or sneak attacks? From what I've read, backstabs are harder to pull off but do more damage while sneak attacks are easier to do but do less damage. Which do you guys recommend?

 

You can never choose between those two, you only get one choice depending on which ruleset is in use. Backstabbing in IWD, sneak attacks in IWD2. No other options.

 

True in iwd there's only backstab, which can be done with both short and long swords, long swords do more dmg though. Dagger, Short Sword, Long Sword, Club, Staff, Scimitar all are suitable. As your rogue progresses his backstab multiplier increases. I agree with Kmonster that mc F/T is probably best way to go. 18/00 is not a must but you will like that, if you cba to roll it, then you can use potions of giant strength 19 before before hiding in shadows, they are pretty common and rather cheap(well at least i was pooping with gold somewhere in the middle of the game).

 

Oh ok. I thought I read in similar posts that you could go to the options menu and switch back and forth depending on what you wanted. Now this is with HoW installed which I thought was the expansion that added this new stuff. Anyways my bad, I misread it seems.

 

HoW gives the option of using either sneak attack ot backstab. I never switched to sneak attack though. I prefer the 2nd editon rules.

 

Using short swords for backstabbing works well too. Which is the best weapon type varies during the game depending on which weapons (the best loot is random) you have available and which weapons your other party members use. You can start with short sword specialization and take the other melee weapon specializations later. You probably won't find a good magical club before the expansion.

In IWD1 you can use the configuration program to replace 2nd edition backstab with some kind of 3e sneak attack which improves only half as fast as in IWD2.

In IWD2 there's only 3e sneak attack and you can use all melee weapons for it. You can simply get all weapon proficiencies with a warrior level. Use big and damaging 2-handed weapons with long range.

 

Alright I'm getting ready to start IWD2 and have been compiling some info here and there to form my party. Still trying to iron out what kind of rogue I want. I'm trying to decide between a half-orc pure rogue, which I know would be the strongest for sneak attacks, and a halfling that dual wields sword swords primarily uses sneak attacks and ranged attacks. My questions about the halfling are should I go pure rogue or ranger 1/rogue X? If I go the multi class option, do I start with the ranger level or rogue level or does it even matter?

 

Start with Rogue, you get a lot more Skill points at level one.

 

Half-orc pure rogue gets full style points from me at least.

Just make sure he's got something with good reach in his hands and let loose with the sneak attacks after the party's tank has aggroed the mobs first.

 

Yea I'm starting to lean towards the half-orc. Kmonster recommend I go with 20, 18, 18, 14, 3, 1 for stats. That sounds good to me but does the extremely low will save present a problem?