An abundance of Bhaalspawn (spoilers)

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Does anyone think that the sheer amount of Bhaalspawn that turn up in Throne of Bhaal is unlikely? In BG1 we only know of a few (the PC, Imoen, Sarevok and probably that guy at the start who "went first".) In BG2 there are no new ones introduced. The fact that Irenicus goes to such trouble to obtain the PC and Imoen suggests that Bhaalspawn are not thick on the ground. Then in ToB hundreds of them turn up (many of them harmless individuals who Irenicus would have had no trouble capturing). Heck, there's even some Bhaalspawn rabbits and hamsters if memory serves. I just thought it weakened the overall plot somewhat for there to be so many.

 

I think the PC was kidnapped by Irenicus because he/she was the most visible, well known (or perhaps only known) bhaalspawn.

I assumed that after the events of bg1 people started looking into sarevok and the pc's lives (being that he had the same markings as sarevok) and things started to surface about the bhaalspawn.

Up until that point irenicus had never been able to find one since they pass as a normal member whatever species they are. It was a coincidence that irenicus found two bhaalspawn, since he was only looking for the PC. If there hadn't been the events of bg1 presumably irenicus would have been still looking for bhaalspawn when the 5 made their move for power.

I assume that the hundreds of bhaalspawn in Saradush were assembled by Melissan herself, using some unknown method to find out who they are (without checking every single person in faerun for the bhaalspawn birthmark) by virtue of who and what she was in the grand scheme of things.

I'd also think that a bhaalspawns power/connection to their divine power is based on combat experience/violence/amount of blood they've shed. so the majority of bhaalspawn who live normal non-violent lives would have been undetectable.

 

My guess is that Irenicus went after the most powerful Bhaalspawn that he knew of. Do they mention this in the novels? I never read them.

 

Pseudospawn already made some good points. I guess it all comes from the fact that before Throne of Bhaal your character doesn't know that there are so much Bhaalspawns. Still the fact that Charname, Sarevok and Imoen are Bhaalspawns doesn't mean that there should not be others.

If you consider the Prophecy of Alaundo and the opening movie in Baldur's Gate you have to take into account that there must be other Bhaalspawns but that you don't know about them.



In fact in the opening movie in the first Baldur's Gate, the Bhaalspawn tries to placate Sarevok by saying that there are others and that he can show them to Sarevok.

 

Remember in ToB there was the slaughter and exile of anyone SUSPECTED of being a Bhaalspawn and their families. Not just those PROVEN to be a Bhaalspawn.

Also each Bhaalspawn has a different 'concentration' of essence. Irenicus probably wanted to find not only a proven godchild but one that has a sufficient strength of soul. Otherwise he may have just used any blessed or healthy individual - he wanted power to regain his own power before his soul was torn from him as well as an extra boost to achieve what he failed the first time round. His sister had already found aworkaround, so getting a little something for her was simply a bonus from his point of view, and another thing to ensure her loyalty and assistance.

 

Some interesting points there - some things I hadn't really considered. I wonder if Sarevok had started his war of murder what would have happened? He might have bitten off more than he could chew perhaps? Certainly I could see The Five being a pretty big obstacle for him.

Also I wonder who the "others" the guy at the start of BG1 referred to were? Apart from The Five is there any other evidence of Bhaalspawn working together? Maybe he was a member of The Five (or The Six as it might have been). And are the hooded people at the end of SOA supposed to be The Five? I have always thought so but considering The Five comprises 2 women (1 a Drow), a dragon-man and a fire giant, it seems strange that they're all depicted as white-skinned men. I've always considered it to be a continuity error but maybe not.

 

The ending video was made before The Five were decided on being more stand out and unsual races.

I guess in theory they could have either passed them off as the five, or perhaps even as a few last remaining clerics of Bhaal trying to decide on a course of action. They cleverly left it very open

There is no In Game evidence of Bhaalspawn working together - yet remember your knowledge in the game is limited to the Sword Coast. Adventurers from other areas of Toril could easily have the blood of Bhaal in their veins yet not earn enough fame or notoriety to become well known in your part of the world. They also are more than likely going to croak Adventurers have a high mortality rate

Remember in BG2 there is Viekang who is introduced, and he states "Not another one" when he sees you and triggers his unique 'abilities' He may have even encountered Sarevok at some point but survived the encounter.

It is possible that the Flaming Fist Guard at the beginning of BG1 had an ability which made him surprisingly good at his job or made him stand out in some way - with the right divination, arcane exploration or divine abilities - he could have easily discovered his heritage and maybe have used similar methods to track down others of his kind.

Even just examining paperwork could reveal information on a persons background, who their parents are, who is adopted under mysterious circumstances, something Sarevok had easy access too once working his way into higher social circles.

The first to die could have had a method of tracking down others that was as efficient as Sarevoks, maybe he intended on warning the Bhaalspawn of what they were or to simply watch them and perhaps recruit the ones showing promise for good intentions. Either way - having a rival who knew what he was and being able to find others of his kind made him the optimal target for Sarevoks first Bhaalspawn-murder.

The game never reveals how many spawn Sarevok finds inbetween his schemes either, he may have travelled far while you adventured arranging bounties and assassinations around the country, even further afield with trade associates.

The trilogy however, is the story of the Bhaalspawn who achieved the apex of his/her destiny, not the fates of the unfortunate ones who could not climb the moutain of bones.

 

I think that the hooded people at the end of SoA are the rulers of Amn, the council or whatever its name. I can't remember and I don't have the booklet or the pdf manual with me so I can't check.

It's just too big to be a continuity error.

I seriously doubt that the guy in the opening movie was anywhere as powerful as the 5. Still, you have to start somewhere and I guess there was a time when even Sarevok was a level 1 fighter.

 

The council of six wear masks, not hoods, they also don't sit around a table with the symbol of Bhaal upon it

Was one of the theories when the first threads about the video cropped up. I think one of the devs posted in a topic on the Bioware site saying it was the five before they were jazzed up and finalised.

 

It would seem strange if that were the case though. Why have a cliffhanger ending with the Cowled Wizards plotting when they're not important in Throne of Bhaal?

 

To be honest, since the series started with the Iron Throne as the villians, I assumed that was the robed group at the end. They are a group with connections all over the Sword Coast. They watched your every move in part 1 and I had that ominous feeling it was still them at the end of SoA. Making me think a part 3 would eventually surface. But instead ToB was released, changing things up a bit. I never really thought the 5 were connected to the SoA ending. It didn't really fit. Anyone know if the developers ever had a gameplan for a part 3, as in another release after ToB?

 

Well, someone else already pointed out that you do come across another Bhaalspawn character in SoA. Granted you pretty much just see him teleporting out of the bar in Trademeet so he doesn't explain then that he is a Bhaalspawn.

I believe when you come across him in Saradush he mentions being hunted so people in the know/former followers of Bhaal/rival Bhaalspawn may indeed have been starting their activities but they weren't brought to your attention because you were too busy dealing with Irenicus.

Yes the ending of BG1 is much better explained (it strongly implies many Bhaalspawn) than SoA's table with hooded individuals ending.

Though the point of the table talk was that this wasn't over for the main character. It is possible that they were loyal former followers of Bhaal-in which case Amelissan may have dealt with them on her own figuring they wouldn't approve of what she was up too if they figured it out-maybe not though.

If they are rival Bhaalspawn or loyalists of Bhaal's they are still undone by the end of ToB.

By the way. As Amelissan was supposed to be the cleric Bhaal entrusted with bringing him back and access to his essence (I think this was stated just prior to the last trial).

As someone with access to his essence she may have had a special ability to detect or sense who was and wasn't a Bhaalspawn. And that is in addition to her being someone deeply in the know of what was going on.

The fact that she had to round up the Bhaalspawn the 5 couldn't find in Saradush to make them an easier target shows she has a better than usual ability to find Bhaalspawn. This could be explained by a special sense/detection ability most people didn't have, in depth knowledge, or both.

It wasn't like the 5 weren't looking for other Bhaalspawn, towards the end of ToB it is mentioned that she brought Bhaalspawn they couldn't find to Saradush for the purpose of trapping them.

 

Good points, I felt stupid reading your post.

Still they were nowhere near finalized that's for sure as I don't see how we can recognize any of the 5 among them.

I always thought there was something ominous about the council of 6, so ominous that I took for granted that they were some kind of Bhaal worshippers or puppeteers monitoring Charname's progress. What if Irenicus actually worked for the 6 that would explain a lot.

Time for more Baldur's Gate conspiracy theories!

 

Actually the council of 6 is basically hidden rulers-so there can be something nefarious about them.

Many of them are evil and one of the main things they concern themselves with is satisfying greed. That Nalia wanted to join their number in ToB is because she recognizes that, as the seat of ruling authority, she can do more with some sort of official control than she can without.

Some of the rulings of the council are in the open and some aren't (at least one of the members has a relationship-in that he is a guildmaster-with the Shadow Thieves, which goes to explaining some of the things they can get away with).

That they have a lawful good woman standing in for official government (think of the lady you go to see for Anomen's family subquest) may show that, in spite of some of the money grubbing ways of many (most if not all) of its members, shows that some sort of justice system must be upheld-even if at least one of the council members is looking for ways to undercut it (with his branch of the shadow thieves).

Though maybe I'm making too much of the background story of Amn and not emphasizing enough the fact there are independent institutions that the council doesn't directly control, and while the Shadow Thieves both influence and know what is going on in the council they may not be viewed as part of its administration.


Edit:

Err...Caradhras, did I open a door there for yet another conspiracy in Amn?

 

Sorry for the near 2 month necro here, but I didn't see it pointed out anywhere that the Prophecy of Alaundo mentions that the Lord of Murder would leave a score of mortal progeny. So that accounts for 20. Of course, it doesn't account for hundreds, but perhaps the prophecy isn't using the word "score" in the literal sense, but rather, it means a "whole $h1tload of" them.

 

I thought a score was 25 but I can be off in my non-numerical understanding of amounts.

Yes it could mean a bunch like 100s or a handful.

 

A 'score' is normally 20, but I think Marceror's interpretation of what it means here is right. Heh, I'm going to remember that next time someone says 'a score'.

 

(chanted ala Candlekeep in BG1)

A bit more accurate, sure, but no doubt I've committed some great blasphemy by altering the words of Alaundo.