Big BAD America

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I am not ususally one to start a topic such as this, but this is really starting to bother me a lot.

I am in full beleif that American people are out numbered on these boards. And I am really quite tired of the "let's blame America and American's for everything" attitude that seems to be immulating in the topics around here.

America is a BAD country! American people are awful, there fat, lazy, stupid, concieted/arrogant, ignorant, assho---! Who can't seem to get it together, unless it is to get into another countries business. Seems to be the consensus around here.

And most of these comments are coming from people who have never even been here! Who get their ideas about us thru the T.V. or radio!

I am really quite tired of it! You don't here all of us "Americans" going around saying as much bad as possible about other peoples countries and the people who live there! Even though we probably could given some other countries past histories. Oh---like for say killing off a race, just because they were of a certian religous background. That is just one example.

So, I guess what I want to say is, gosh darnit---be respectful! And if you don't like American people----then don't bother talking to me in the chatroom, or around the boards.

Cause I happen to be proud to be an American. And I don't go around putting other people down, and blaming everything on them, just because of there origin or race. Please don't do it to me.

 

Well it's not the american people, it's the american government and US' way of politics that cannot be understood by Europeans. I consider US a paradox, I cannot understand a country with so many in-country problems can raise so much in power.

And the political system is crap in my opinion. Using billions for election campaigns, and the one with the most votes aren't even elected! What do you need electoral(sp?) voters for? It's NOT what I would call the will of the people. But the will of the ones with the most money.

 

Its because they use expressions like 'gosh darnit'

 

Thank you Satiana, you said it so well.

 

Satiana, I know how you feel. I am growing tired of the rhetoric around here. I try to ignore the posts and often stay out of it. You can't fight deliberate ignorance. I call it this because many of the most vocal America bashers did not even reply to the post that I started a while back "have you ever been to America?". How people can have such deep negative opinions about a place that they have never even visited amazes me.
I would never presume to understand California, much less England.
There are so many experts here who "know" that America is evil, or arrogant, or imperialistic, or whatever. They make these statements as if they are fact, with very little, if any, facts to back them up. All the while, they are ignoring their own countries histories.

I will call out anyone from England, Germany, or Russia to compare histories side to side with America and see who has the most blood on their hands.

Any takers?

 

*Laughing Hysterically*

Hi. Um...my name's Sapiryl...and I...*sob*...am...an American!

1) Eh, let's see, we use more than 1/3 of the world's energy.
2) We are the proverbial watchdog of the globe.
3) We spend more money on the military in one year than healthcare, education, and environmental protection combined.
4)We can kick just about everyone's ass, and continually remind EVERYONE.
5) We use peace talks as cover ups for military insertions (Gulf War).
6) We have supplied EVERY major uprising faction for the last sixty years.
7) We are the most censored country on the planet.
8) We advocate the death penalty, and abortion.
9) We have the greatest education system on the planet, and the lowest average GPA.

I'm not trying to say we suck or anything, I'm just listing the reasons why people hate us. I have excluded religion and Britney Spears for obvious reasons.


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[BIG EDIT!!!!] - I'm not saying that any of these are true, I disagree with a bunch of them, I'm just quoting what I've heard others say about America. Sorry if that was not well made out!

[This message has been edited by Sapiryl (edited April 22, 2002).]

 

What's your point? Most of your line items either false (4, 5, 6, 7, 9) or opinion (2). I can't verify 1 or 3, and 8 is just a bizarre observation.

You live in America. Claim to be a full time student (obviously not studying history, American or otherwise). And you can't make a clear, well supported point. I've always believed that our education system could be improved. You've proven it.

[This message has been edited by Jack Funk (edited April 22, 2002).]

 

About our government...

It's like the Old Republic, I'm just waiting for our own "Senator Palpatine" to show up .

About our education system: saying it could be better is an understatement.

 

Oh God.....

Come on people. Enough of this.

The bottom line is that most people in the US don't give 2 shits about what the rest of the world thinks. Remember that the USA is made up of people who wanted to GET AWAY from those countries in the first place.

 

That wouldn't be fair! American history is so much shorter (unless of course you count all the histories of all the countries Americans emmigrated from in which case it's the bloodiest country in the world).

Anyway the reason why people dislike Americans is clear: most powerful country in the world therefore a nice mix of envy + jelousy + pedjudice + fear + selective thinking + Bush = dislike America.

Not that America is doing much to dispell that attitude but then again why should it?


PS I just read Sapiryl's list. JF, why do you think no.4 is not true?

 

Point 4 is not true because you cannot conclusively make that statement. Can the U.S. kick Chinas ass? I doubt it. Nuking each other doesn't count as a win.

As far as the history thing, I will compare U.S. history since 1776 against any of the countries mentioned.

Llandon, you may not give a shit about the rest of the world, but I do. People are people to me. And the point that most Americans don't give a shit about the rest of the world might be (is probably) true, doesn't make it a valuable point. Can anyone from any of the countries in Europe honestly make a different case for their country? No.

I would never say that America is perfect. I can't even say it is the best country in the world. I haven't lived in all the other countries. I just get tired of reading statements about America that also apply to many other nations.

I stopped posting on these types of topics because it was apparent to me that many of the people here don't want to have a real discussion. They just want to express baseless opinion without considering that the world may be more complex then they think.

[This message has been edited by Jack Funk (edited April 22, 2002).]

 

Jack! Read my freaking post edit. Then drag out your arguments.

But just in case you don't feel like it:

I was listing things that I had HEARD other people say! Why do think I included the thing about Britney Spears and religion at the end? Because Spears is the "Great Satan"?

I give up.

 

You should join the chatroom sometime Jack Funk, once in awhile these discussions pop up without the I'm right, you're wrong argument. But it is a matter of opinions that makes the difference. The matter of opinions has origin in what you think is right and wrong.
An example would be me and Shralp; We dont quite agree on the US gun politics but agree on the issue of capital punishment since we have some different values and some that coincide.

And it's hard to discuss on boards anyhow because it takes a long time to resolve a debate and thereby people tend to be quicker in jumping to conclusions.


[This message has been edited by Lokken (edited April 22, 2002).]

 

Sapiryl, no offense intended. I did read your edit and understood it. Initially, the sarcasm was lost on me. The reason I addressed a specific line item is because Vukodlak asked me a question about it.

 

I second Vukodlak's opinion, except the Bush part. Who is the president doesnt really matter. Everyone have had mixed feelings toward the biggest and strongest person in the school yard, doesnt really matters what he does. And the international political scene is much like a school yard, no rules apply you rule by force or dont rule at all. The US is by far the mightiest nation in the world and no one is able to withstand them, not even if all its allies would abandon them which they wont (remember the school yard, who wants to cast of the biggest boys favour once you have earned it?)

But one thing I have learned when studying political science is that the most fervent US bashers in the world are often the intellectual elite IN the US not foreigners.

Another point I must adress is that the US has done and is doing some very strange freaky things abroad, I probably judge them harsher than any other nations but that is mostly because their supreme power. As Peter Parker sais, "with great powers come great responsibility". And the US might not live up to that standard all the time...

But I dont think no one judges a whole nation, all french people arent snotty, all iraqi arent terrorists and all americans arent fiercely nationalistic arrogant people with no regard for human life if its not american. Heck I dont think there is even very many of these generalisation in the world.

 

Joacquin, I beg to disagree- all French people *are* snotty. I've been living in Canada for most of my life now and I still haven't been able to break the habit.

Sapiryl, I'm sorry to say that for me, at least, your post really backfired, because I was going down the list going, "yes, yes, yes". The "most censored" one gave me pause, but when I considered it in the context of 1st world nations I decided it was probably true. I was so embarrassed when I realised you were being ironic! I think #4 is the big one I just can't disagree with- regardless of whether America can or can't kick everyone else's ass, there is no shortage of Americans who incessantly brag about the military might of their country and the total helplessness of everyone else towards them. For those of you who doubt me, I can only remind you of Shralp's unforgettable (to me, at least) post in which he proposed nuking France because "it's not like they can fight back or anything". A joke? Maybe to the ones on the firing ends of those nukes, but just imagine how that sounds to one from the country so jokingly threatened- especially because we *know* it's true that we are defenceless against you.

Many of you who are American may not be aware of just how rude your countrymen often are to "foreigners" (even when they are guests in our countries or homes!). When you are enraged with people in other countries having negative perceptions of America, one of the first groups you should point your fingers at is those Americans who make nuisances of themselves among the people of other countries. We get negative perceptions of Americans through negative experiences with Americans. Now, I'm married to an American and have met many lovable Americans in my life (especially in the years I spent at American schools overseas). But I'd have to say that there's an unusually high number of assholes among the Americans I've met, too. For those of you who are genuinely kind and well-meaning people, I am sorry that these people have tarnished your reputation on the international scene.

 

You know what I noticed through all these posts? That most of them are media based. It's no suprise that most every one hates America. We put pratialy every thing on TV from Turning the White House(to show off) to Fly With Fighters(more show off). If we here on thing we spread it, on and on it goes and it gets wacker every time it's retold. Rumors.

Now I'm an American. And not tring to diss anything or any one but really. Most of what you hear, say and see is over exicerated as much as possable.

Earth is in it's biggest turning point right now. Earth as a whole. But some how every one seems to blame other countries and so on so on. But from those blaming people come people who want to right the wrong. Those people will become the new Enistin, Marcopolo, ect. We need debats and changes like these to change the world. Look back in history and in any history their will be at least least one thing that changed a whole lot and now is just a common day thing.

 

It's amazing to me, Sprite, that even on this topic, where an American person is kindly asking not to be bashed, and stating her case in an intelligent manner, it's amazing to me that you come here and post a long winded American bashing.

You say "we" like you personally represent every non-American. Please don't be so presumptious as to speak for every Canadian, or every European, or every Asian, or every whatever, just because you ran across a few unsavory Americans.

It seems that at every turn, you have something snide to say about Americans in general. It's fine to have opinions. I have a few myself, but by stating your stereotypes as fact, you are spreading messages of hate. Stereotyping and prejudice are tools of the ignorant.

As a civilized group of people, one would think we're above snotty, culturally degrading comments.

What I'm saying, I guess, is that in this topic at least, no one was asking for your opinion, your bitterness towards our country, or your justifications for hate. Like my mama always said, "If you can't say anything nice..."

 

What *is* Amazing is that the US hasn't conquered the entire world, if they are so fanaticly evil, brutal or whatever negative adjective there is to cram down upon them or their government...

 

Do you think complaining about your reputation is a better way to change it, than trying to pinpoint the reasons for your reputation and fixing them? If so, I wish you good luck. You'll need it.

I have a great idea! Drop flyers from your bombers saying "gosh darn it, I'm proud to be American." That'll do it. We who've been attacked, insulted, and threatened by Americans, and have therefore learned that a lot of Americans are aggressive, irresponsible and arrogant, will immediately realise we've been wrong and learn to love you.

Please. Learn to take some responsibility for your reputation and your actions- then maybe you'll be viewed differently on the international scene. Boasting about your national pride is hardly going to solve the problem.