Dialogue mode = "safe pickpocket" + safe kill nonviolently ... (it's a BUG)

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It is possible to:
a) pickpocket any non-violent NPC without turning them to violent when PP fails
b) kill non-violent character without turning them violent

I discovered this in Illithid Lair. Some mind golems are there around. They are not violent, but if they see some of your party members, they produce Mind fog (drains INT). You can avoid to be seen by them or kill them. As I wanted EXP from them I decided to kill them. I killed two of them - by two tanks with bludgeoning weapons plus support from cleric (+ some battle micromanagement: one tank is running, other is beating ...). But as I tried to attack the third golem, I attacked by one tank, but "spoke" with the second. (Speaking with golem means: text in info window saying something about golem).

And what happened ... My first tank "scored" three hits per round and the golem DID NOT turned violent against me. Then (in paused mode, I have autopause turned on for end of combat round) I again mistakenly spoken to golem (click on second tank, and use on golem). Then I thought, that if I'm speaking with this dumb golem (no INT from his mind fog ) I'm distracting him from all things ... and then my cleric distracted him to dead (whit help from two tanks beating him). The fourth golem was a piece of cake. I though - dumb golems ... (no bug)

But I noticed more - when I clicked with handle (not attack) on the fourth golem, he DID NOT created the mind fog - he saw my whole party. Strange ...

In the next days (in Kuldahar Pass) I tried to pickpocket Nathaniel. I clicked on him with my cleric - mistakenly while paused. Then clicked on my thief portrait, choosed "thieving => PP". Then realized, the game is paused. Unpaused. Choosed "Farewell" in dialogue. PP failed. Nathaniel stayed cool. (I'm sure: IT'S A BUG)

I tried it dozen of times. PP non-violent char by thief while speaking with the same non-violent char by other teammate means SAFE PP: if successful OK, if failed no offense from PP-ted person.

As I'm a programmer I would say:
If a character is in dialogue mode, his "all subroutines" are off (another handler is in use) - except only dialogue "subroutines" are on (dialogue handler is in use).

I use it for PP as Take10. (I'm paper player originally). I don't use it for "fighting" originally non violent characters.

P.S. sorry, for crying (uppercase words)
P.P.S I'm head of software quality group of development department in a softwarehouse of 300 people ...

 

I am not sure this is 100% reliable for ensuring non-hostiles.

I had been trying to pickpocket Dolon Daemba in the Black Raven Monastary for his charm ring (I took the non-violent path where I expose him to Aruma and they both leave - taking his nifty ring with him).

I dunno what the DC is on him, but I had my rogues PP skill up to 37 and STILL failed most of the time - anyway, on one of many fails, I accidently hit "talk" and he stayed non-hostile...so I thought...*groovy!* I will just do that to save all the reloading.

Well, after about three tries I succeeded, and got the ring - and immediately thereafter they all went hostile. I am not sure why, since I had succeeded.

I can only assume it was programming kicking in from the fails prior to that?

 

Bah! Seems like an otherthing people will use as a lousy cheat, just like the deadly dialogue-trick (or whatever the name was) to kill the wickedest dragon called Firkraag, in SoA.

 

This happens in SoA and ToB too.IMO this is a bug related to the infinity engine.

Yep i hate that too.It was supposed to be one of the hardest dragon combat in SoA...

 

I mentioned this in a recent thread when someone killed Nickademus (sp?). Anyway, it works but not always. And there's no guarantee that they won't be hostile after.

[ February 20, 2003, 09:54: Message edited by: Charlie ]

 

Tested it specifically because you mentioned it and it does not work. They will go hostile each and every time. I have latest patch, and I'm pretty sure it did not work in BG2 either. Nope, pickpocket by tricking is a sure fire hostility method.

Bluey. I was trying to get stuff of Dolon last night too, and so I used the Bard Song exploit and got up to 80 PP and still failed every time almost. "Stuff it"... I said to myself.

This does not seem to be an exploit after all...

Damn

 

Ha ha ha ha ha. You failed to realise one of the major spells that you should have casted. Cats grace is a ripper of a thing to cast.

My bard/rogue has 12 ability in pickpocket. Take off armour, 18. Plus Dex. 20. Plus song, and you have an unstoppable pick pocket force.

I got the ring, and his wand of melf acid arrow.

Anyway,
Cheers.

 

- to Bluey: maybe not 100%, but there are NPCs that turn violent after failed PP and with "dialogue" they "stay cool"
I'm sorry for repeating - I read things on this forum (only on areas that I've been already through and on bugs, to avoid them), I tried to find this, but did not ...

- to khazraj: read "to bluey", more to this: I tried it on some NPCs - worked always, maybe there is some little thingy: I always "pause/click/unpause/farewel" - maybe in real time they manage to set "go to hostile variable" and then you catch them with dialogue - this could "delay turning to hostile" - no offense, I don't wanna say that you click in this way, but maybe ... - or it sometime doesn't work ... or there is a trigger on PP succeed also ...

- to Baezlebub: I use cat's on PP, eagle's on merchandise, ... but this is a problem after PP failure ... which could happen with bards song + magic PP boost

[ February 25, 2003, 09:14: Message edited by: Quicho ]

 

No offence taken by me! Its quite possible since I wasn't trying to do it to begin with - I had stumbled on it by accident, and just went with it.

Heh - might have to give it another shot now that I am in HOF and can't seem to PP anyone.

 

I found by accident too.

Then tryed one some old savegames.

Can't proove 100% on every non hostile.

Have a nice HoF.