Fahrenheit 9/11

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I saw this movie over the weekend, in New York City. I'm glad I saw it there...It seemed like a lot of people there remembered events of a few years ago that gave the film more impact.

Overall, I thought it was a great movie! I enjoyed it from both an entertainment and political standpoint. And if half of what is shown in the movie is true, Bush needs to go! And amazingly, I voted for the jackass 4 years ago!

I won't give away any spoilers, but before I saw this film, I was still wrestling with my choice for President in this upcoming election. Now, although still not a supporter of Kerry, I will take up the rallying cry: "Anyone But Bush!"

There just seem to be too many coincidences to dismiss, and the film left me feeling as if I had been hoodwinked by the politics and media slant of greed. As I've said many times before, the U.S. needs a strong, viable third party to compete in national elections...We'll never truly be a free, democratic nation without one!

My advice on seeing this film: If you're voting in this years' presidential election, this film is a must see. At the very least, it'll give you a few things to mull over.

If you're not planning to vote this year...You suck!

 

It was the number one movie at the US box office last weekend, taking approximately US$21.8m to make it already the highest grossing documentary in US history (after only 1 week!). This is despite only showing on 868 screens. This gave it a per-screen average of about $25,115 (compare this to the opening weekend of Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban which made $24,303 per screen).

Clearly, all the pre-release controversy has translated firmly into box-office dollars for the film-makers and distributors, just as it did for Passion of the Christ earlier in the year.

 

I just got back from seeing it. I'm somewhat speechless on it, I recommend any U.S. citizen to go see it, even if you are a Bush supporter.

I can't even describe how I feel about it because watching made me feel a mix of sadness, horror, intense (really intense) anger and actual real sickness.

It also made me tired.

My girlfriend cried a bunch of times.

Unbelievable.

 

I haevn't seen it, but I was under the impression that it didn't actually reveal much that everybody didn't already know, especially those who follow politics in any way (like regulars in the Alley of Dangerous Angles). I had been told that it just skimmed the surface of the same old accusations but without providing any further insight.

From browsing the AoDA it seems that most of you already have a fairly strong idea of GWB's intelligence, level of corruption, agenda etc....

What does this film have to add?

 

Um...maybe y'all should read this review by Christopher Hitchens, who ain't a rightwinger by any stretch - he once dedicated a whole column to why the Ten Commandments were ridiculous, and he's directed about a dozen documentaries himself, including one calling for the head of Henry Kissinger.

Not to leave you in any suspense as to Hitchens' utter contempt for the movie, but here are two quick sentences:

and

 

So there you have it. Who do you believe?

For the makers of this film, it probably doesn't matter because both believers and un-believers pay the same price for their tickets.

 

Yeah, well, Hitchens has also staked his famous break with the left on his support for the Iraq war (following his support for NATO's action in Bosnia, etc.), so he's not exactly an unbiased observer here.

And if you're interested in "Al Jazeera propaganda," you might want to check out "Control Room," an interesting documentary of Al Jazeera (and CentCom) during the start of Iraq II.

My verdict on F9/11: I enjoyed it, and am glad it's come out to the reception it has. It wasn't a *great* work of art, nor did it really deserve the Palme D'Or, but then again Moore never set out to be a great artist or filmic craftsman. Its value was in its provocation, and in this way it works as a nice corrective to the political spin of Bush and Iraq II at Fox, etc. Sure, Moore is biased against Bush, and F9/11 is quite heavy-handed at times, but it's great to see a re-contextualization of all of these now iconic post-9/11 images and events in a way that doesn't so reflexively equate being pro-American with being pro-war and pro-Bush. In short, F9/11 is IMO good for America, and I hope lots of people see it.

 

GM, that review is unbiased? What qualifies as biased to you?

@Harbourboy, even if you knew all of the corporate connections, and the other miscellaneous things (the Bush sponsored Taliban tour of the U.S?), the movie still has enourmous impact from just watching the U.S. "precision bombing" and the unbelievable horror that comes from it. Children ripped to shreds, etc.

Its stomach turning, but at least its not the watered down made-for-tv war that we get in the States.

 

Well, I haven't seen it yet. I did see Bowling for Columbine, so I know what to expect from Moore. I'm not exactly a fan of how Bush has handled things, but I'm afraid to watch this documentary and not have anything to balance it out after it. What I'd like to see is a documentary made in response to it. Then I could sit down and watch them both back to back. That would be cool. Sidenote: the whole "precision bomb" thing is exactly why I got out of Air Force ROTC back in 2000 (before all the craziness of Sept. 11 and such). After the visit to the local Air Force base I decided that wasn't for me. Civilians should not be killed...period. No matter what country they live in.

 

Fahrenheit is the best after shave ever ohhh it smells so nice

[Too bad the IoTW plaque is currently taken...] -Tal

[ June 30, 2004, 14:07: Message edited by: Taluntain ]

 

I wear that too....Spammer!

 

I didn't claim it was unbiased - and I prejudged the review by describing Hitchens' "utter contempt", so no one was unwarned - but only that it didn't come from the typical conquer-the-world-for-rightist-imperialism that I usually ooze.

Hitchens could have pointed out that, say, Bill Clinton was once study buddy at Georgetown University with Saudi Arabia's Prince Turki - eventually slated to head Saudi Arabia's dread secret police network. (Check the new Clinton biography, "My Life", for the president's discussion of this fine friendship.) Are there any such close links between Bush and the House of Saud? And does anyone really think that Clinton is the pocket of the Saudis because he happens to be good friends with some of the most powerful among them? As Hitchens points out in a casually explicit moment:

Fine, one more wholesale quote from the Hitchens review. (I'm...I'm becoming Ragusa!)

This applies, incidentally, to all the one-sided conquer-the-world-for-rightist-imperialism nonsense, too. Propaganda is its own artform - an entirely defensible, even necessary one - but the best propaganda emphasizes the positive while downplaying the negative, instead of indulging outright deception. Untruth merits a good whacking, whether politically agreeable or not.

 

More like a conservative square!

Anyway, as Ankiseth_Vanir has correctly pointed out, since I haven't seen the movie m'self it really isn't fair of me to comment on it, save linking to another's review. I thought Hitchens' column was interesting because I disagree with most everything else he writes. (Uh, not to disparage Hitchens - maybe I haven't read a good representative sample.) I assumed the rightwingers would oppose the film, of course, so there's no reason to link to them - but Hitchens' looked like a non-rightist analysis of the crafting and intellectual side to Moore's arguments.

Call me cocooned ("Cocooned!"), but I don't think I'll watch it. I skipped "The Passion", too, based on the negative reviews and my own distaste for graphic violence - I didn't think I needed to see Gibson's film to come to a pret' clear idea, given the reviews, of its content. Same with Moore's.

So this isn't a good place to argue pro- or anti-Bush arguments, except in the Moore context, where I must concede the ground to Hitchens and ArtEChoke. Maybe another post? When I'm not so busy with Thief3?

[EDIT: Here's a Newsweek article that deals with the supposed Bush-Saudi connection, the Afghanistan pipeline, the Bath-bin Laden financing, and the Saudi flights after Sept. 11th. That should answer your questions, DMC.]

['NOTHER EDIT: If you'd tired of reading honest leftists bash the movie and would like to see what the right-wing thinks, check out this.]

[ July 08, 2004, 23:47: Message edited by: Grey Magistrate ]