Football Hooliganism

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Yes, that old chestnut! Football hooligan was big a few years ago, then it died off for a time, now it is back on the rise a bit (at least in Italy and Spain).

I'm just intrigued by what people not from Europe think about the levels of hooliganism in football.
We all pretty much know that hooliganism is most evident in sport of football than in any other sport (it's almost bloody exclusive). Why is this?

My theory is this. Anybody who follows a football team 'properly' will know all about historic rivalries. These are much deeper than I have seen in any other sport. Like, I'm a die-hard Chesterfield FC fan (you've never heard of them, so don't be racking your brain thinking). We HATE 2 teams in Sheffield Wednesday and Mansfield Town. Now, when a team comes to our ground there's a little rivalry, mostly friendly and good natured banter. We can talk and have a pint with the other fans in pubs, But when Sheff Wed or Mansfield come to town, it's a completely different story. There's always a heavy police presence, who make sure that the pubs only have fans of one team in them and the other teams fans go in other pubs. You'll have hundreds of police officers in and around the stadium making sure that the fans are separated at all times. They even make us leave at different times after the game to make sure the fans don't get mixed up as they exit the stadium. The simple fact is that if the 2 sets of fans get together and get a chance to get at each other, they'll usually try and rip each others heads off.

It sounds stupid but that kind of thing is just PART of being a fan of my team. If you're a fan of Chesterfield then hating our main rivals is just part of the gig and it's hard to fight the urge to think '****ing scummers!' whenever you hear the name 'Mansfield'.

Every single team in the UK has similar rivals. It's all part of the old history and, culture and customs in football.

The rivalries are just far more fierce than in other sports. In cricket England don't like Australia all that much, but it's always good natured. In rugby union, we're not on best terms with Australia or New Zealand, but again it's usually good natured. But in football, when an England fan hears 'Argentina' the blood just seems to boil and you just automatically think 'cheating wankers!'.

Just like I can imagine that in baseball or basketball or in gridiron there are rivalries. The Yankees might not take kindly to the Red Sox but it's a kind of 'meh, don't like them' kind of rivalry not a 'scumbag ****ers!!' kind of rivalry.

I just wonder why this is!

 

I'm English, but from the sources I learn about American culture from ( the Simpsons and South Park), rivalries between different "football" teams can get pretty heated.

Or it's just that the filthy Colonials don't have enough history for such rivalries to develop.

[ August 19, 2006, 21:21: Message edited by: Clixby ]

 

Shouldn't this be in the AoDA?

 

Or the Colosseum?

 

Same with being a Green Bay Packers fan and hearing Chicago, Bears, Minnesota, or Vikings. (The Detroit Lions were never good enough to raise ire. ) The rivalry is there, and we react to it, but the rioting and such just don't match with our idea of good sportsmanship, for the fans as well as the players.

In fact, the worse thing I've seen was insults hurled during college volleyball playoffs. I guess they have that announcement before the games for a reason.

 

Compared with Brazilians and some Argentinian 'hooli-fans', Europeans are babies.
Sao Pablo and Flamengo (Brazil), River Plate and Boca Jr (Argentina) are rivalries (sp?) that causes big riots down there. They really hate each other, and I too wonder why or when all this started, because when DiStefano played in River Plate (really way back) there wasn't such violence. In Brazil is the same, they get to kill rival fans, and the riots are even unstopable for the police when fans start it. And of course, for some reason I don't know, any football fan chearing for Argentina, hates Brazilians/English, as Brazilian hate us and Uruguayos (there I can understand as Uruguay let Brazilians without the World Cup with the famous 'Maracanazo').
Here at Spain isn't too rough, is more a political than sporting issue. Madrid hate Barcelona but not just because the rivalry, but because 'Catalunya is not Spain' thing going on from long time. Here every fan may cause some riots just because anything: When Barça became champion, fans gathered in the usual place to celebrate, but about thousand of them caused riots. But as I said, there aren't too much hooligans here and rivalries aren't too violent. Again, babies, compared with South Americans.

 

The difference is that South American roughies (and idiots from Turkey as well) are quite happy to REALLY cause each other harm and even kill each other.

That doesn't really happen here. Fans will arrange a meeting somewhere before or after the game, and kick the crap out of each other for a bit. This is just fists and kicks though, no weapons. They'll have a bit of a scrap, then go off to a few pubs for a few pints.

I've seen people from other countries carry weapons to fights and that's just taking it way too far.

The main problem is the whole culture of it. Guys arrange a fight and fans of one team HAVE to win, or they lose their reputation. It's all about reputation. Everyone wants to be known as being the 'hardest' guys around and so viewed as people not to **** with. Then when you get this culture everyone keeps trying to outdo each other. Mix this in with the guys involved getting smacked off their **** on drugs and pissed as farts on booze. There's jusrt loads of pent up anger and hatred. There's just bound to be fights and it's really hard to the bobbies to keep it under control. Very hard. But thankfully, it's being dealt with very well in Britain and has been for a few years now. Experience has told our police how to deal with it and to a certain extent control it.

[ August 20, 2006, 01:05: Message edited by: Barmy Army ]

 

Speaking from my own experiences (yes, i've been one), i can say that there's not really a big story to all this. It's mainly a bunch of guys trying to defend their hometown against an invading crew, and the invading crew tries to make the homecrew look bad on their own turf, if possible make them bleed a bit too. It's not even necessarily about football, because if there was no football, these guys would somehow be involved in other gangrelated stuff one way or another, i'm pretty convinced of that.

Rivalries are usually born when two crews had some memorable clashes in the past. Then you'll end up in a violent circle, an eye for an eye and all that. Some guys take it even further, by tattooing "f**k off <insert rival's name> on their arm or chest. It's a way of life, and one that i don't particularly miss all that much.

Rubbish, what makes you say that ? Because there are more casualties in Rio or Buenos Aires when there are footballmatches ? Perhaps that is because the authorities simply don't give a crap, and deliberately let them have at eachother for a while before they put the hammer on them. I don't see the difference between deaths in south America and deaths in the Netherlands for instance. Our hooligans carry baseballbats, knifes, iron chains, and other items with them when they go on the road, and in some cases handguns and explosives. I challenge you to take place in a stand next to Feyenoord's hooligans and taunt them a little, then you'll find out first hand what babies they are, although there's a serious chance you won't live to tell the tale.

[ August 20, 2006, 18:51: Message edited by: Pac man ]

 

Well, if you're standing next to the Feyenoord HardCore ("F-side"), you'll be alright. Standing against them might be foolish, though. And Brazilians or Argies might sound to them like Just an other Carlo Picornie. I wouldn't like to have trouble with any gang, of course, whether it's the F-side, ADO Den Haag, Ajax...

Never heared of any big troubles in other sports and I always had the idea that Europe was worse off than other continents, but that might be caused by the influence of the media.

 

MoN, I don't think you'll be alright if you're standing next to Feyenoord hooligans and you call them the 'F-Side'. (That would be taunting them a lot )

 

Ah, thanks for the warning. I usually don't get involved with this hooligans-stupidity, but living quite close to Rotterdam asks for some knowledge about these Mofo's every now and then. Perhaps I can call myself lucky with one or two "friends" in that scene.

 

Err, I don't think you understood, perhaps I wasn't too clear... The F-Side are Ajax supporters. So, calling Feyenoord hooligans the F-side when you're standing next to them isn't the best idea ever.

 

What!? Man, that was most likely the stupidist thing I've said in half a year!
Clearly, I don't spend too much time with these people, which makes me proud, actually.

 

Ajax fans thought too that they were safe standing on the next stand with a nice big iron fence between them and the Feyenoord fans. That was until someone tossed a homemade fragmentation bomb in their stand, filled with nails and razorblades. It's never safe to sit right next to a stand filled with hooligans, it's best to take a seat at the other side of the pitch, i know all about it. I remember one particular match in breda where someone had smashed a toiletbowl, and all those big white pieces of porselain came flying over the fence. Of course some people picked them up and threw them back, but a few seconds later they were returned again. For 45 minutes i had to look out for flying crapperpieces, made me miss out on most of the first half.

And yeah, calling Feyenoord fans F-side is a deadly mistake.

 

Hey Barmy - ever seen the movie "Green Street Hooligans?" If so - how close to accurate is it? From what you've described, it sounds like it is.

 

The film is **** and the content is bollocks mate.

Try to track down a film called I.D. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113375/) to see an accurate film about hooliganism. Or even Football Factory, which is pretty decent. But Green Street is a load of bollocks to be honest mate.

 

Yeah, Frodo comes to London to teach the West Ham boys how to fight.

 

It's growing more and more in Sweden. Just yesterday, Lars Lagerbäck's(Sweden's National Team Manager) house in Stockholm was bombarded with rocks and flowerpots and a large "LARS QUIT" banner was put up, covering his door.

 

I don't regard such an outburst as hooliganism, more like a bunch of fans who got fed up with their headcoach, it happens everywhere, even in the most calm places. It's a different story when fans start stabbing eachother with knifes, just for the hell of it.