Getting the most out of your party bard

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1) Race

Human bards are the best. There is no need for any single stat over 18, and no need for a wide range of high scores. The bonus skill point and feat will be critical.

2) Abilities

A good bard does not engage in melee or ranged combat. The bard songs do not work while fighting. Knowing this, why would you spend any points in str or con? 6 hit points per level is as much as any mage, there is no need for more. Strength is only significant for combat, and your bard will not be fighting.

Reccomended:

Str: 08 Dex: 14 Con: 10 Int: 18 Wis: 10 Cha: 16

3) Skills

Your 18 int human gets 5 skill points per level. this will allow you a wide range of selections. Take the rogue lockpicking and trap disabling upgrades wherever possible. All three conversation skills should also be invested in, as well as alchemy and lore.

While you will not be able to max out all the above, you should still be able to keep all at an effective level. Using your bard to replace your rogue will allow you to replace him with another more effective character, and combine all your non-combat needs in one efficient package.

After your standard two fighters, cleric and mage, you have room for an extra class. Perhaps a druid or second cleric for more healing power. Maybe a third fighter Perhaps you want 2 mages. Whatever your choice, removing the rogue from the mix gets rid of your least effective fighter and allows you to replace him with one of your choice. While the rogue skills are certianly useful, it's simply impossible to expect your rogue to melee as well as a barbarian, or fire arrows more effectively than a fighter.

4) Feats

One of the best ways to raise your Bard's AC without losing anything is to use the Expertise feat. Even though your bard will not be attacking, he can still benefit from the AC bonus that expertise gives. This coupled with dodge and other defensive feats will more than make up for his low hit points.

One of the least used feats is dash. Most players simply don't care if their party can more 15% faster or not. For the bard, dash is incredibly useful. It's always nice to have your primary lock picker, item identifier, talker, and explorer (invisibility) moving faster, but there is a combat advantage as well. The bardsongs work while moving, so getting a monster or two to chase your bard around while the party deals with the rest can be a huge advantage. The bard also has to change position a lot, making sure the entire party is within the range of his songs. Sometimes this gets him in the line of fire, and dash is great for running away, casting a spell, and running again... all without ever taking a hit.

Investing 2 points into armored arcana can be very good, depending on the makeup of your party. I had two mages in my group, so there were very few bracers and robes left over for the bard. There is some exceptional leather armor in the game, and since you no longer have a rogue, giving the bard a couple of levels of Armored Arcana can be a very good investment.

Other feats worth getting... Lingering Song, Dodge, Luck of Heroes, Great Fortitude. Don't bother with anything increasing your attacks... including weapon finesse.

5) Spells

This is pretty straight-forward, but a few things bear mentioning. Depending on your party's makeup, you will want to pick up complementary spells. Having one character cast Malison while the other Slows is a nice opening for any battle. If you have only one healer, invest in some healing. Chromatic Orb is easily the best first-level spell later in the game, combining decent damage for it's level with a stun or hold effect. In general, let your mage handle the fireworks, and use your bard for disabling or utility spells. Try not to double up on spells unless they are critical or self-only. You don't really need two characters who can cast a spell like knock, but having two characters who can mirror image is fine.

[ September 25, 2002, 01:22: Message edited by: Blackthorne TA ]

 

I made a bard for my first party and she was similar to the one you mentioned only she had less intelligence less strength and more charisma and constitution. He was also an asimar so she had a 20 in charisma which helped a lot and I took the archery feats and gave her a bow and she contributed a lot to the party. Also if you check some other topic I created about helpful bugs for bards you'll see how with the lingering song feat you can have all songs on all the time and heal all of your party between battles

oh and by the way to add to that helpful bard bugs topic if you use the last song the way I mentioned in that thread right before a battle and then within two rounds engage in a battle (don't do it during the battle cause the enemies get the same bonuses) you can have as much armor class as you want (I have reached 114 AC before I got bored doing it once) and as much damage reduction as you want from weapons (I reached aproximately 145 once in all bulgeoning slashing and piercing weapons) though they do spoil the game so it's not that good an idea to use them

 

I have a half-elf bard chick in my party.

Her name's "Bard". I'm not good with remembering which names go with which class, so I keep it simple.

She's leading the party, actually. She totally rocks. She's a backup spell caster, dual wielder. Carries the bag of holding.

I don't use her songs much. Usually, I just have her wade in there and do a little dicing. But I like to keep her songs in reserve in case I get into a tough battle. I've not had a single character die on me yet, so none of the battles have been "tough".

There's been a couple of dialogue options for the bard so far, but I'm hard pressed to remember which ones. I'm just not into the story all that much. There's too much stuff that seems like the BIS guys were running out of ideas...

 

My party leader is a paladin, so he can dialogue when an NPC "jumps" the party. The bard is in the back. Bard's songs are so powerful... you should use them almost all the time!

 

Good lord did I just really read a post in this thread that claimed "rogues are not really effective fighters"??! Jumping Jehosiphat Man! You are telling me that doing say 6d6 damage (a level 11 rogue with a shortsword) is not that great??? I have a pure lev 15 halfling rogue, HIGH dex, 10 str and he dual wields a +4 shortsword and +4 dagger. With Weapon finesse, ambidexterity, two weapon fighting, and crippling strike, he is a melee monster. NO strength bonus is needed. He averages 44 damage a shot now. He is as valuable a tank as my dwarf fighter/barb, or my palidan. As long as you are willing to lovingly guide him behind an enemy (preferably one engaged in spellcasting or fighting my palidan or dwarven battlerager) he will shred the enemy as/more capably then an "effective fighter" could.

Hmmpf, rogues are useless fighters indeed.

Dan

[ September 27, 2002, 02:30: Message edited by: Lord Nad ]

 

Well, actually, a "tank" is not the same as 'anyone who does melee damage'. Tanks are all about taking damage, which rogues are not good at.

Also, while sneak attacks are nice, the game implementation does not let you do them repeated to the same target. You may do 44pts on your first hit, but you will not be doing it on every hit. This is partially true do to engine limitations and partially as a balance issue (because the AI will not react rationally to the flanking threat of a rogue).

Rogues are not worthless, nor is that what the original poster said. He said there are more effective characters and that is certainly a legitimate point of debate.

 

There's no way in hell. Say for example you take a third melee class... let's say a Half Orc Barbarian. At level 12 my barbarian will not only have over 200 hit poitns and be able to backup-tank, but will also be wielding a 2-handed weapon with 22 strength. Did I mention the 3 atatcks per round? Those kind of help. Using the somewhat crappy +1 spear from the dead hunter quest, he does 16-38 damage PER HIT. That does not include criticals, 15% of his attacks do triple damage. Best case scenario for your rogue is a 6-36 point strike every time you can "lovingly move him into position". My barbarian does better on a normal hit, to say nothing of his criticals. Let's not forget that he hits 3 times a round, to your rogue's twice. While your rogue will plink away for 7 and 8 on regular strikes, the barbarian routinely lays down 20-30 point beatings, and quite often will critical hit an opponent and deal 80 damage, then cleave through another with the extra attacks. The rogue skills are cute, but the math does not lie. You are kidding yourself if you think otherwise. The rogue is a utility class. If you are going to have a bard in your party, you are best off combining the skills of the two.