Grandmastery possible in an unmodded game?

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Is this possible in a BG1/TotSC game?

Start as a Human Fighter, with **** in Large Sword (or whatever) and dual class to Thief after level 6. You should have enough XP to reach Thief level 8 then, and that's when Thieves can add a proficiency point.

Is ***** possible?

 

Yes, but as thieves cannot even get to specialized, you will not be allowed to add to your large sword proficiency. There is simply no way to get to grandmastery within the limit of the XP cap.

 

That's weird, because this works in BG2....

 

That's only because BG2 doesn't hold you to the same restriction as BG1, where you can only put ** into anything as a first level character. So a 6th level fighter in BG2 could put 5 of his 6 stars into long sword when he really shouldn't be able to. I have tested it in BG1, and I can assure you that it does not work for exactly the reasons I have outlined, and that you shouldn't be able to in BG2 either. Their dropping the restriction was likely a matter of ease in coding, since proper checking for doing it 'right' would require some inventive code.

EDIT:
Just tested it in BG2 (starting in SoA at level 7 with **** in long sword and ** in Single Weapon Style, and CLUAing XP after dualling), and I have to say . . . that is one severe bug. Congratulations on finding such a heinous exploit, Klorox. It still won't work in BG1, though.

[ April 10, 2006, 04:28: Message edited by: Felinoid ]

 

Too bad, I thought I was on my way to finding the most butt-kicking PC in a BGI only setting.

Oh well.

 

Well I think part of the reason BG 2 doesn't do it is to open up for the possibility of those fighters that did nothing but specialize up to the point they reach the game. Since it is possible to get Grand Mastery in BG1 if you plan out your game this seems to be the reason behind being able to spend so many dots in BG2.

edit: Grand Mastery is possible in BG1 for a single class fighter all the way through the game if you have TotSC. Not sure about without it. You want that and to dual you would have to dual after you get into BG2 though to have it work for a dual class.

[ April 10, 2006, 11:37: Message edited by: starwalker ]

 

No, it is NOT possible to get grandmastery under the XP cap with a single class fighter, TotSC or no. The TotSC cap is at 161,000 XP, which restricts you to 8th level (150,000). To get grandmastery in BG1 you would have to get to 9th level, which requires 300K XP; quite clearly outside of the range. In modded games (with XP cap removed) it would be possible with a smaller party or bonus XP from the mods, but that's not what Klorox asked.

 

I believe in another post I mentioned you cannot get ***** in BG1 -- but thinking about it there is ONE way....

Human Fighter -- Take to 3rd level and get your *** in one weapon (weapon restrictions apply for clerics/druids).

Now dual to your new class (either thief, cleric, or druid). At 4th level you get you old class back AND another prof point (****). At 8th level you get ANOTHER point (*****).

I think you can get Shar-Teel grandmastery if you're quick enough.

 

@T2B:
That's what we were just talking about, and as I said before, I tested it and it did not work.

 

No, you said dual after 6th level fighter -- I'm saying to dual at 3rd.

 

It's still the same problem. You can't build stars on as a non-warrior class.

 

Listen to Fel you shall.

Only warriors (fighter, ranger, paladin (and in messed up bg2, barbarian)) can put more than a single star in any weapon (the level of "proficient").

fighter, ranger, paladin, barbarian can "specialise", aka put two stars into a single weapon.

Only a pure Fighter (no multi) can put 3,4 or 5 stars in any one weapon.

At level 1 you can put max 2 stars in any one weapon with the warriors.

And a level 3 fighte coudl put hes 3rd star in for example long sword, and then dual to thief. if he puts any points into long sword he will have 1 star. and when he regains hes fighter levels hes 3 stars will overide hes 1 from thief. At no point can he put more onto the fighters already 3 stars.

Any other class can never put any star into more than 1 on any weapon.

I hope that was clear enough. That is how it works in BG1 and in 2E. BG2 is bogus.

 

One small issue, raptor: That's not how it works in 2e. In 2e, there are 3 levels of proficiency:

1) Non-Proficient (you don't know how to use said weapon, and suffer a penalty to-hit if you use it)

2) Proficient (no THAC0 penalty, no bonus either)

3) Specialized (+1 THAC0, +2 Damage. Only single-classed Fighters can become specialized)

 

No, any warrior can, whether single-classed, multi-classed, or dual-classed (provided the warrior class is active).

There is also some debate on the veracity of the grandmastery rules, as I do not (currently) have the book that the rules supposedly come from.

 

With BG Triology you can put 4 stars in any weapon at the beginning of the game. I am not sure about Tutu but I hear you can.

As Fel stated though in BG1 you cannot place more than 2 stars into any weapon proficiency during character creation. This will limit you to a total of 4 stars by the time you reach your maximum level.

 

Fel, according to the Player's Handbook I have, only a Single Classed Fighter can become Specialized in a weapon, something that is clarified in The Complete Fighters Handbook.

This does not count out dual-classed characters, but you can only become specialized while gaining levels as a Fighter.

 

Well, that might be also changed by the book in question (Combat & Tactics, IIRC), or it might have simply been a 'universal house rule' in my area. I have to say I would lean more toward the former (or both), since it was included in BG1 and they didn't make any other mistakes (aside from the weapon groupings).

 

Ah my bad, that is indeed taken from Players Options, Combats and Tactics. It is one of those books i have yet to find a 2E player play without

Yes in PHB 2E there is only the 3 levels of "Unproficient, proficient, specialised" (0,1 and 2 stars). And only pure fighter gets the specialisation.

I take those rules for granted, especially since they have been implemented in all the BG and IWD games for example. but BG1 does it about right compared to the books, so my above post is mostly acurate for the expanded weapon mastery system from Players Options - combat and tactics.

Sorry about that, forgot to think about what books you used, *sigh*.

 

Hello, how are you? Have we met?

Anyway, I think this thread has run its course, with a definite answer of NO to the specific question Klorox posed. Unless there are some follow-ups?

 

Combat and tactics...that's where we let the dumb player go first and then kill him and everything else with spells from afar right?

I've never owned that book.