Interesting Dual Class Combos

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My brother and I were bored last night and trying to come up with some interesting, rarely-seen but perhaps under-appreciated dual-classing combos.

Afterall, everyone's heard about the old-standards; Kensai-Mage, Kensai-Thief, Swash-Mage, etc...how about something a little different:

- Archer(9)/Cleric(19): probably a better dualclass than your standard fighter/cleric. He'd have a pretty mean sling (** proficiency, +3 hit +3 dmg bonus) and full access to both druid&cleric spells.

- Swash(10)/Cleric(20): swash's can't backstab anyway, so may as well dual him to a cleric where he can wear plate armor & helmets (and still be able to find traps and do locks). Why be a figter/cleric when this combo can handle all your dungeon adventuring needs, have +3 better AC, and just as good fighting abilities? A very nice character.

-Cleric of Lathander(10)/Fighter(18): Pure fighters cap at 19, this fighter caps at 18. Meanwhile, this guy gets a fun assortment of priest spells (better than those avaialable to a maxed out ranger or paladin, imo), and the boon of lathander ability would actually be pretty fierce in the hands of this fighter (2 casts per day, +1 hit +1 dam +1 extra attack +1 all saving throws, last 60 seconds). Better than a blade's offensive spin.

Avenger(pick a lev)/Fighter: A character who can wear plate and still cast 6 mage spells as well as druid spells has some interesting possibilities...

I guess the theme here is that some of the more exotic priest dualclass-combos are often overlooked (by me anyways). I'll hafta convince my friends to do a big multiplayer game with these "wierd" characters some day..

 

Bravo! Great thinking!

I think I have to use one of those combo's also( and tell my friends that I came up with those ), especially the swash/cleric!

 

- Comments:
Always very interesting to think up new combos!

Avenger can only dual class to Fighter if you import him from BG/TotSC since you need Strength 17 to do that and Avenger gets -2 strength during character creation.

Archer/Cleric
I like Ranger/Cleric more since it would be a shame not to use this character as a front line tank. The Archer/Cleric is not good in melee.

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- Some other dual class ideas:
Kensai/Druid is an alternative since we're talking druids.

I like Fighter/Mage better than the Kensai/Mage. It's good to use helm, shield and bracers.

 

Yes Swashbuckler/Cleric is a very good idea indeed!

 

Yeah, the more I think about it the more sense Swash/Cleric combo makes from a powergaming standpoint (though it is admittedly a bit of a roleplaying challenge, heh).

In fact, after crunching the numbers it turns out a Swash/Cleric is better in melee than a Fighter/Cleric. How can this be? Well, their base THAC0s both end up being the same. Meanwhile, the Swash gets +2 to hit and damage with ALL weapons, while the Fighter has the ability to obtain grand masteries in certain weapons, which only gives him +1 to hit and damage with those weapons. Figure in that the Swash also gets a nifty +3 ac bonus and 290 thief ability points to distrubte it becomes a no-brainer. Especially since thieves can still detect traps, open locks, and set traps while wearing platemail. The only advantage the fighter has is his extra HPs (only about 20 more).

Swash/Cleric is truly a nice character, the more I think about it. Would be a great character for people who like to do the game in very small groups of 3 or less.

 

Like everyone else, I really like that there Swashbuckler/Cleric thing you got going on. Wild adventurer who finds god and joins the clergy. Not so hard to roleplay. Robin Hood joins priesthood. The Fun Nun.

As for Druids, I don't think you can actually dual to or from that class. Same thing goes of course for Paladins and, I think, Sorcerer, Monk, Bard, Barbarian, and (could be wrong) Ranger. You can only dual TO a plain Fighter, Mage, Thief, or Cleric (the basic four), and FROM one of those classes or one of their respective kits/specialties. Which rules out a lot of really cool combinations - I like Monk/Sorcerer, myself.

On somewhat related note: Has anyone tried those three or four custom kits (available on this site somewhere for download I think)? One of them is a Archer-like kit for elven Druids. Another was a Wizard kit that results in a sort of Monk/Mage.

[This message has been edited by The Grim Pickle (edited May 01, 2001).]

 

There appears do be loopholes in the system. Several people say they have dual classed a ranger and a cleric although the book gives you an impression that this is not allowed. And then there's an avenger/fighter but what about a shapeshifter/fighter or a totemic/fighter as well? I wouldn't be surprised if somebody piped up and said they had a dc sorcerer monk if you have full install and say "Jon Irenicus" backwards 3 times
Well I haven't tried those custom kits. I've thought about it, I just hope they aren't buggy. Has anyone tried the whole game with one?

 

I never post anything that I haven't confirmed by testing it in the game first.


On page 19 of the manual it says:
Characters not allowed dual-class status include paladins, rangers and druids.
The manual is wrong!

You can dual class any combination allowed as a multiclass combination - except obviously for the F/M/T and F/M/C.

Often the manual is written before the game is finished. This could be a programming flaw but just as well an intended feature, who knows?

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Another swashy combo:
Swashbuckler-11/Mage-17
The mage abilities support the thief. Invisibility and Knock can be used so that the thief abilities could be used for something else instead of Open Locks and Stealth.
This mage will have a good AC.
He can't backstab, but that doesn't matter since he's useless in a fight anyway- bad THAC0 and only one attack/round - unless using Tenser's Transformation.

 

The dc & mc swashbuckler-mages ... I really like this combo and I stored one in a warm place to play him one day.
I think the mc swashbuckler-mage should be a valid multiclassing option for elves for their 19 dex, beeing as good in combat as a fighter-mage but also offering the thieving skills of the mage-thief ... the best alternative to the universal fighter-mage-thief, with the inability of not beeing able to backstabb (but since there are potions of invisibility .... ). He should be more capable than a blade, providing more thieving skills and more and better spells. Well, everyone is his own DM in BG-2 and the AD&D manual frequently says "... when the DM allows ..."

The dc swashbuckler-mage has excellent advatages: Unrestricted thieving abilities, when the base thief is from BG-1 most probably a good strength and dex-19 making him a great thief and a good missile-weapon fighter too. His THACO actually is pretty bad but the dex-bonus would correct that a bit when using missile weapons.
Give him the bracs of archery and gesen´s bow he should be pretty good. He simply has a different role than a backstabbing thief.

PS: The ranger-cleric is an allowed multiclassing option available to half-elfs only.

[This message has been edited by Ragusa (edited May 01, 2001).]

 

The Swashbuckler kit info says this:
- Bonus +1 to AC
- He gains another +1 bonus to his armor class every 5 levels.

I've found this to be incorrect.
I just made a level 23 Swashbuckler with 18 Dexterity and when "naked" he has AC 2. If it were correct he should have AC 1.


- Calculations follow:
Start -> AC 10
Dex 18 -> AC 6
Bonus +1 to AC -> AC 5
+1 bonus to AC every 5 levels -> AC 1

 

The big problem with the swashbucker/cleric is that you will be limited to clubs, staffs and slings as these are the only weapons usable by both classes.

(Hey, a staff wielding swashbuckler/cleric, got to call him Friar Tuck!)

And I'm currently playing with a fighter dualed to Druid, so it isn't impossible, but I had to give myself a high charisma, and be true neutral. High wisdom may be necessary as well.

 

Huh? Why shouldn't a swashbuckler/cleric can use warhammers/flails/maces? Am I missing something?

 

can a druid dual to a cleric or vice vera?? they would have good spells

 

Tal just posted a new kit...It's called the Panty-Bandit, created by the Big Green Priest! Check it out at:
www.sorcerers_I'm_messing_with_you.net

Not terribly powerful, but they can weasel their way out of anything!

 

Maces and Warhammers are not thief weapons, unless Swashbucklers can use more weapons than other thieves. I thought it was just that they could specialize in weapons unlike other thieves, but I've not played around too much with thieves in BG2.

 

FAQ about the Dualclass Swash/Cleric character
(tested & proven in game 5 minutes ago, using CLUA console cheats)

Q: There seems to be something wrong with the Swash kit description -- it says he receives +1 bonus AC, plus an additional +1 for every five levels. Yet my level 23 Swash is only experiencing +4 worth of AC bonus, not +5 as you'd expect.

A: There is bug here. For some unknown reason, the Swash does not receive his AC bonus at level 20 like he should. Nor does he receive his +1 THACO & DMG bonuses at this level. I do not know the cause of this bug. Before level 20, however, everything with the Swash kit functions normally, consistent with the description -- at levels (1-4) he experiences +1 ac bonus, at levels (5-9) he expereinces +2 ac bonus, at levels (10-14) he experiences +3 ac bonus, at level (15+) he experiences +4 ac bonus.


Q: Wouldn't a Swash/Cleric only be able to use the weapons in common between the 2 classes (clubs, quarterstaves, and slings) ?

A: Yes and no. When a thief dualclasses over to a cleric, that character can use any weapon in allowed by clerics -- yes, even non-thief weapons such as flails and maces. Obviously, the character can no longer use swords, daggers, or bows, and any proficiency points you spent in those weapons as a thief are forever lost (wasted). HOWEVER, in the case of Swash/Clerics, things are a little more complicated. If you read the Swash kit carefully, it says that he may "specialize in any weapon that a thief can use." In other words, a Swash/Cleric can only place one proficiency * in flails, maces, and warhammers. He can put two **'s in quarterstaves, slings, and clubs.


Q: My Swash has two **'s in a certain weapon proficiency. Both the manual & the in-game information say that this level of weapon proficiency grants +1 hit, +2dmg, and 3/2 attacks per round with the weapon. My Swash recieves the hit and dmg bonuses related to his level of specialization, however, his number of attacks per round is still fixed at 1 when it should be 3/2. Why?

A: No clue why this is happening. I haven't played the Swash character enough to be able to determine whether the Swash is actually getting his extra 1/2 attack or not. If he truly is only swinging 1 time per round, and not 3/2 like he should be due to his ** proficiency, then this really hurts the viability of the Swash character. Does anyone have an answer here?

That's all for now...

 

Apparently only fighter types get additional attacks for weapon specialization. Something in how they coded it I guess.

And yeah, what was said about 2*'s in thief weapons, but still 1* possible in cleric weapons not usable by thieves is what I meant. But if you don't specialize in one of the cross-over weapons it makes the swash part less desirable. (though you still could put points in two weapon fighting and have that carry over.)

Darn, all these interesting class choices, stop me before I create again!!! (I have 5 games currently, all in chapter 2...)