Israel vs Lebanon: Deliberate Targetting of UN Positions, Red Cross?

Remove all ads!

If you fire a precision missile after 10 warnings, you know what you are doing.

More:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Israel-Lebanon_conflict

WTF? They're asking for an international peace corps in Tel-Aviv. To Hague with them. Enough is enough.

Of course, Israel is not Serbia or Iraq or whatever. There will be no bombing of Israeli positions by anyone.

[ August 01, 2006, 13:40: Message edited by: chevalier ]

 

~shrugs~ theyre in a warzone, death happens

 

Um... Wow. Hopefully that was sarcasm or a weak attempt at baiting people. The U.N. hasn't been able to "interfere" yet because, apprently, the U.S. has final say on anything the U.N. decides to do.

Meanwhile Israel is free to bomb innocent civilians in Lebanon in a futile attempt to flush out the terrorists. If you botherred to looks at the death tolls maybe you'd realise this isn't war so much as a massacre... Of innocent bystanders.

 

The Alley needs this thread like the Nameless one needs another scar.

That being said please read the UN press release on this.

Here is the money quote, that I'm sure the UN regrets putting in the release and nobody wants to talk about.

Maybe I'm the crazy one, but it certainly seems to me like the U.N. troops knew that Hezbollah was using them as a human shield to launch rockets at the Israeli's. Israel tried to warn them to get the hell out of dodge, but instead they decided to stay and basically provide cover for the terrorists.

To me this is yet another failure of the U.N. If they are supposed to be there as peacekeepers, that doesn't mean sit in your barracks and pretend nothing is going on. If anything they should have arrested the terrorists or even better would have been to kill them outright while they were setting up their attacks.

 

On our news it was said these UN observers outright begged Israel's forces to target them no more.

True colours shine through is all I can say.

 

If they would do that then the UN should also go into Israel and knock out all the Israeli artillery pieces and dismantle the Israeli warmachine. If Hizbollah are terrorists then so is every single Israeli soldier and if they arent then they are both soldiers.

Either this bombing was either an honest mistake, we have seen many times that precision bombings arent very precise and all organisations are sluggish and slow to react and communications are never as good as they should be. The other option is that they found the UN station to be in the way so it was removed.

 

That's the most logical explanation. I don't doubt that the UN gave the Israelis many warnings to stop firing at those positions. But obviously, they weren't giving those warnings to the military personnel conducting the bombardment. Just because a warning is given, if it's not disseminated throughout to all involved parties, it is completely possible that the officer who order the bombardment at that location didn't know he wasn't supposed to be firing there. The Israelis know that there are many in the international community who are none too pleased with their actions. They wouldn't deliberately blow up a UN barracks to turn opinion further against them.

 

Or they take the view that the people who find them in the wrong wont find them anymore in the wrong by doing this and the people who support them would still do so even if they nuked Beirut and Damascus. I doubt opinion matters much to Israel anyway, they got a "get out of jail free card" in the US who will stop the international community from ever doing anything that would hurt Israeli interests.

 

Given Israel's history along these line I would think ANY reasonable commander would pull out. To think Israel would allow UN Troops to 'aid the enemy' in ANY way is folly. There have been many instances where UN troops have acted inappropriately or were just plain stupid. After being told to leave, given several warning shots, and being told to leave again I would classify the UN troops as 'just plain stupid' in this case. Sometimes stupidity is fatal.

And without the US military just how is the UN going to accomplish this?

 

I thought the second quote was sarcastic? And granted the U.S. military is the most powerful force on Earth. That being said, there are OTHER militaries...

I think now that Al Qaeda is urging extremist mulsim groups to join in the fun is EXACTLY why the U.S. and U.N. should have stepped in already. The lack of action is already cause more problems than it has solved... Basically it can be used as proof that the Western world doesn't care about muslims.

Unless the U.S. is hoping this goes so completely out of control that they can step in and take control of the entire region. Like they did in Iraq. And that has worked out so well so far.

 

Hmm. Israel kills neutral observers, and since that's just what Israel does to non-combatants/civilans (see history), the neutral observers are to blame for Israel's actions. They even end up being insulted.

What is wrong with this picture?

 

Phil, sorry misread the thing. Thanks.

Dendri: Israel has a very traditional view of war. They kill people. They make it difficult on everyone in the war zone because that discourages anyone from helping the enemy. They believe in a massive strike to disrupt the enemy and then continue pounding away until there is no more enemy. It works for them (as it would for anyone else).

The Hebrews have been targetted for thousands of years. The Inquisition and holocaust are just two examples. The Nation of Israel is not willing to be bullied and will fight back with everything they have, every time. Remember these guys believe in an eye-for-an-eye. Another old testiment lesson: genocide is okay as long as it's not God's people.

The old rules of combat apply: the bullet has the right of way. When something goes flying by in one direction, expect something else to coming from the opposite direction. It's just like in WWII: unit A is fired upon from direction X. Unit A returns fire in direction X until nothing moves. Civilians and neutrals are expected to be smart enough to get out of the way. Neutrals who provide cover for an enemy are allied with the enemy. This is all very basic stuff that the UN observers should have known.

As I said, it is folly to believe anything else. The commander in charge was just not thinking. It's not his/her fault the observers are dead, but he/she could have easily prevented it by leaving.

 

T2, thank you. (utter lack of sarcasm here)

I dont trust myself enough to say more on that matter, though. Perhaps nothing more needs to be said.

 

I think Israel did it to say "It is none of your business" to the other countries and they know US supports them in any condition. And Hezbollah is not more terrorist than Israel, the things going on in Lebanon is pure terrorism, I think. It should be stopped but a conflict with Israel means a conflict with US, other countries doesn't want it.

I won't say all of my ideas about US and Israel (I mean their governments and the supporters of these governments, not everybody in that countries) because they can be counted as insults and some people certainly will take offense.

 

The Inquisition in Spain tracked false converts to Christianity, not Jewish people per se. The Holocaust isn't just one example of genocide against Jews, but none other has claimed that many victims, both in direct number and in proportion to the total populace in the world... I think (not sure about the latter, especially if we consider parts of the world, not the whole).

 

The 'victim mentality' is quite annoying. The Jews are not the only people to have suffered. Besides, its hard to be both the victim and the occupier.

 

Yes, but one can argue that the Palestinians are in large measure responsible for their own suffering.

During the 1967 war 300,000 arabs moved out of Israel to the neighbouring arab countries (and Palestine, which at that point was supposed to be part of Jordan). At the same time, 300,000 Jews moved from the arab countries into Israel. All these jews have become citizens of Israel and been integrated into society in a few years. On the other hand, the arabs are still inside refugee camps, which are a breeding grounds for Hamas and the like. So I would say they are in large part responsible for their own plight.

 

Do you think that somebody would choose to live in a camp if there was no other alternative?

Do you have any idea what it's like to have to flee from the place where you were born and to leave everything behind?

I don't think so.

How would you react if somebody implied that the Jews were responsible for the Diaspora?

[ July 29, 2006, 12:55: Message edited by: Caradhras ]

 

I'm with Bruno on this one. The Israelies have been under attack from various 'unoffical' groups for as long as I can remember. Finally they have an opponent with ties to a country's government so they have every reason to attack as needed (government sponsored military is viewed as that country's army).

Reminds me of an old World War II quote I heard "If it moves, shoot it. If it screams in German, shoot it again!" If you're under fire from a position you have every right to return fire in equal, lesser or greater force. You don't want to be shot at? Then stay away from people who are shooting.