Life after death

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DO you believe there is an afterlife?
Many cultures believe there is one. Many religions do too. There are also those who don't believe in one.
I was raised in the Catholic church and was taught that there is an afterlife. But as I got older I started getting interested more and more in science. So I started looking at my religion, more specifically what I learned about heaven and hell, from that standpoint. I started to question whether it does exsist. While I don't regularly attend church, I do still believe in God and the afterlife. I was married by a priest.
As part of a paranormal investigation team, we did see some things that could not be explained. While there was nothing difinitive, it did lead us to believe in the possibility.
What are your views? Keep in mind no one is right or wrong in regards to this. I'd like to just know what people think.

 

I was raised as a catholic too, but since like 6 years after my 'hervorming' (I don't know the english translation for it, but it is the next mayor thing after communion at the age of 12 or something in that number) I realized that religion said nothing to me.

I can safely say I don't believe in a god, and don't believe in reincarnation either.

The beauty of this question (and answer) is no one knows for certain, you can believe in it or you don't. I am very curious what happens when I die, but I am not wondering if their is a heaven or hell.

So you could say I am impartial on this question and like it this way, I am not counting out either option and will see it when I die, that is what it makes it so interesting.

 

My experience with the RC church is similar to yours, Apeman, but I took a little longer to reach that point. At this stage of my life I'm loosely agnostic - I believe that there is a God, but its exact nature is unknowable. Religion is a purely human construct, developed for either:
1) Individual solace in times of strife, or
2) Profit through control of a large populace.

As far as heaven goes, I'm torn. I like to think that deceased people are able to "look down from above" on what their loved ones are doing, but I can't see any "future" for myself past death. I have no anticipation of going anywhere in particular. I guess I'll just live my life as best as I can and be surprised when the time comes.

 

As someone pointed out already, it is completely irrelevant in the end what the case really is. For as long as nobody knows, it is all up to each of our personal beliefs. As a religious friend of mine once said, freely quoted:

"It doesn't matter wether god exists or not. In the end, all that matters is that you yourself can feel safe while alive, and when you'll die. When you go through hard times, can you really trust in any human? Certainly not. For a part of being an adult is to be intellectually evolved enough to understand that no human is perfect. There is not one being on this planet that can always help you, always support you. For that reason, we need a god. A being who is supreme, who never does mistakes, and who will always be there for you. Wether he exists or not is not a factor. That you believe he does, is. For a lone human, with nothing to believe in, with no-one to trust in, is much worse off than the one who decieves himself through his religion. Afterall, all you need, is belief."

This was very well said. I don't believe in a god. I want to, and I try to, but in the end I don't believe I do. But I recognize the need for a human to do this. I can freely admit that those rare times when I experience extreme difficulties, a prayer will ease my feelings and condition far more than a talk with the person I care/respect most. I don't care wether there is a god that receives those prayers or not, all I care is that it helps me. And so it is with death as well.

I do not believe in afterlife either. But if cheating myself through trying to believe in such will make me feel any better, then I will do so. Be the source of this help a divine power, or a simple mental defense system, its purpose can only be good. To turn your back towards such a help is suicidal and idiotic.

[ January 10, 2003, 15:21: Message edited by: Forashi ]

 

I believe there is some sort of afterlife, but I suspect that is because I simply cannot grasp the concept of existence, and I can't imagine the world without me. (Where will I be if I'm simply 'gone'?). For me it's better to think of it as 'afterlife' than to worry about it too much and go insane...

I was never raised to believe in any god, and I doubt I will ever find myself associated with any religion. It's not the message of religions that is the problem; it's more the way religion has been practised where I come from that has left a bit of a mark. ('Holier-than-thou', and all that)

[ January 10, 2003, 16:26: Message edited by: Faded ]

 

I have never believed in Heaven or Hell
I don't really believe in re-incarnation as most people consider the term to mean.
I guess I tend to look at death as the end of my body and self as I know it, but I don't necessarily look at that as the end. Kind of a conundrum huh?

My spiritual vision for afterlife is one in which my life force/spirit returns to the source. In my mind this source is something completely non-human, more like a great ball of energy.

 

Seeing from above posts my point of view will add something new to discussion. I've been RC since my birth and, however not a fanatic, I've always been very serious about the religion both internally and externally (and yes, I am roleplaying). I do believe in afterlife. It's nothing to be proved scientifically, but it's not the point of faith. Something close to this statement can be derived from various teachings of Jesus recorded in Bible. There would be no question of faith at all if we didn't need to believe.

 

I have strange beliefs, I believe in souls and stuff. I think that peple are reincarnated into either their greatest desire or deepest fear. I also believe in the potential of the dimensions. I think it is possible for them to overlap so that someone can completely cease to exist in one world but live longer and/or have more impact in another.

I think that even though it can't be said to be true or it may be considered foolish - there have been people forgotten as time wears memories and there have been people living for yonks and having a profound impact on society. People are also have said to think of relatives or someone who has gone in a certain place or by a certain animal. It is not proof, but i think it is a nice idea just the same.

 

My beliefs are much like Faded's. I do belive there is somthing after death, but it might simply be because I can't grasp the concept of not existing.
A few weeks ago had my toncils removed, and was put to sleep with narcotics. Everything just went black, and then I woke up. It felt like there was no time between falling asleep and waking up.
I believe that death is like that, but i can't imagine what it would be like. Oh well, I'll find out sooner or later...

 

Well'm, I guess I would classify myself as an atheist. I believe that the above statements about the necessity of people to believe in something better than mankind can be found to be true. For me, I don't see that necessity. Through mental conditioning, bad experiences with the church, Rand's works, or some combination of that and more, I don't feel any NEED to connect to a supreme being.

I see myself as perfect. Now, wait- let me clarify. I see myself as being, at this moment, at this time, both the best and worst I could possibly be. For that, I am perfect. I am balanced. When I suffer, I do not turn to a being of supreme good and ask for his aid, the same way I do not turn to a dark lord when I rejoice. My happiness, my sadness, my needs, are MINE, and to me, even if there was a God, to ask some other being to help me would be taking something away from the merit of my life. I want to live my life, not have my life lived through God's blessing. If I stumble, let me stumble, if I break, let me break. At least then I will know that it is my hand by which I came to such an end. At least then I will know that I have truly lived, and not simply echoed my life.

When I die, I will cease to exist as far as I'm concerned. Other people might remember me, talk to me as though I could hear them, but the entity I see reflected on my computer screen will no longer exist. Plants die, animals die, inanimate things are destroyed, water boils, wood burns, and what is this "supreme sentience" that makes me so arrogant that I believe I am somehow different, I am somehow better? My body shall fall to ruin, those delicate nerve connections that I need to live will fade, and my body will change form and composition, become compost, just as the wood turns to ash, the water to vapor. Never shall those nerves reconnect and form me again, just as the ashes will not reform the tree, the vapors not reform the river.

Amon-Ra

[ January 10, 2003, 21:01: Message edited by: Amon-Ra ]

 

WOW Amon-Ra, great reply

I dont believe in god (he havent really proved that he exists ) but i dont know if i believe in afterlife.
Since so many people have seen ghosts (i have heard one, and had my lights turned on by themselves) there gotta be something about it.

 

All I'm going to say is yes, I do believe in God, and heaven and hell. I am a Roman Catholic, and I attend mass every Sunday. Please, don't ask questions about me, just accept my opinion.

 

I believe in life after death.
That is nohow linked to gods nor any higher beings. Religions added several explanations on it only because the science cannot find a proof that it exists or that it doesn't exist.

There are plenty books about it. Please get anything about NDE (near-death experience) from dr. Raymond Moody. He got in investigating that phenomenon first and found out that almost all of these persons who were brought back to life (different religions including atheists and different cultures) experienced almost the same things while in state of "clinical death".

Amon-Ra, y'see, you won't cease to exist!
No matter how you hoped that there is a way to avoid your responsibilities. Everything pays back. Here or there, it doesn't matter. Read the book ("Life after life").

[ January 10, 2003, 21:38: Message edited by: Extremist ]

 

I like to believe we have an inner spark, soul or whatever...You can see it in peoples' eyes, and I've never really seen it in an animal. I can't really explain it very well, but I think humans are gifted with something that will "live" long after our fragile casing has ceased to be.

When I look at the world around me, it seems as if everything gets recycled, soil feeds plants, plants feed animals, etc...New things grow every season, the cycle of life, etc...It's always seemed to me that the world is constantly renewing itself, why shouldn't peoples souls be recycled too?

 

Sir Bel, maybe you just can't see it in animals because you're not one of them. Maybe wolves see it in other wolves, cats in other cats.

An interesting thing about that supposition that things recycle- things recycle to maintain an equilibrium, so that coincidently no one thing can dominate and all may live in some kind of natural balance. [predator/prey balance, predators die off if they overdo it, etc]. Yet if souls live on after death, and new ones are being created every day through birth, wouldn't that produce an overpopulation of souls? Souls aren't being recycled, they're being stockpiled. Where are the soul-eaters? [This is why a lot of people believe in reincarnation]

Supposing souls exist:

I think that we live and die an infinite number of times during our "lives", as we change. I am a clearly different person than my past selves, but recognizable as me because I can trace all the changes [i've been there for most of them ] and most of the changes have been minor. But when something happens so traumatic, so wrenching-you-from-your-capacities as death, would we be able to recognize ourselves, so changed?

I would be some ghastly entity, roaming the heavens or here on earth, not able to speak and be heard, unable to dance or play with those I love. That, in my mind, is not a blessing but a curse. I would be ripped from my body so that I might spend an eternity never knowing, never feeling what it is to live as me again. That is the cursed shell I would become if there is a life after this one.

One thing I feel I am sure of: I have but one life here, in this form, with this mind, and this body. Whatever "soul" transends this form will not be me. It might have been a part of me, but I am body and mind as well, and when they die, this configuration dies, and this configuration is all that this configuration is concerned with.

Amon-Ra

[ January 11, 2003, 00:48: Message edited by: Amon-Ra ]

 

I do not believe in reincarnation because it's just too scary. Not the best reason in the world, but that's my opinion.

My belief is when you die, you "go" to the same "place" as when you sleep. Except that your heart and brain stop functioning, so there will be no dreams. Just complete unawareness of time or where your body is or who you are. Even the blackness of inside your eyelids is unnoticable.

Again, I did not base my belief on anything. Didn't read what religion or science or cultural-based media says - just pure personal ideas.

 

no.
Still I enjoy life. Envy me dreamers?

I am not christian. I am a friendly and helpful person without any evil intentions and I ESPECIALLY don't need a cookie at the end of the line to be that way. Like some do... I simply cannot find any mortal logic in God's plot, except making us his own amusement park.

God made the worst "deal", I've ever read about, with Satan. And God is supposed to be divine, so so ungraspable ingenious to create the amazing molecular structures we are made of. Creating the uncomprehendable multiverse/universe. And then He/she/it sux so much at diplomacy? Yeah right; Bible Bogus. I'll see you in hell. At least I have a couple of good Islamic friends to meet there. They are bad. They are non-christian. lol Yeah, religion is so good for mankind. We deserve heaven so much more than animals...

EDIT; In christianity why can't animals go to heaven? Or can they? How selfish of men to claim superiority over souls. Weird I would say.

EDIT TWO; Amon-WinRaR, If you get a transplantation will you then cease to be you? The bigger picture of your ending paragraph, indicates you will. Just let the doctors know that you need a new social security number. That's one way to wash your hands after convicted of murder. Get a transplantation. HAHA! Good one Amon-Ra

EDIT THREE; Amon-Ra you can't put a Hardy-Weinberg equilibrium onto paradise, and say it gets overcrowded if the predator/pray system doesn't rule there. I know it is not your invention so no offence meant, but that is about the stupidest argument against christianity I've ever heard. I'll get back to you on the size of paradise when I have talked to it's designer over supper.

[ January 11, 2003, 15:24: Message edited by: Nobleman ]

 

Nobleman, I agree with you about the animals. Having worked with many intelligent species, its almost inpossible for me not to think there is something more there.
I'm going to say something completely contradictory here. I do not really believe in organized religion. "But," you say, "you were married by a priest." Yes, I was. But he was kicked out of the church because he married. (Catholic priests are not allowed to marry. Hmm nother topic) Anyways, he does offer a weekly service. But as he puts it, you don't have to kneel when everyone else does. If you want to sit the whole time you can. It is more like people getting together and connecting spiritually.
My beliefs in the afterlife are more like those of Native Americans. I am related to everything around me. I am not NA and don't claim to be an expert there. So I do not want to offend anyone. But I get more out of going for a hike in the woods by myself, then going to the noon mass on Sundays.

 

yes I believe in God. And yes I believe even more firmly in heaven and hell. Not as a cooky for doing good, but as the result of the choices we've made on earth.

Why I believe in this is hard to put in words, there are too many little things that add up together. The main reason for believing in God is that by believing life starts making sense. Without a 'higher Being' there can be no morale. So it wouldn't matter if I would take a gun and shoot say my neighbour, or if I would help the old lady next door doing her shopping. This would drive me insane. So in that way it is my active choice. Next to that I see a lot of wrong things happening in churches (castrate all those bloody priest that lay their hands on children! ) but that's not God's 'fault. we mess up.

If you believe in God you should be in all the way. You can just take a little part to your liking and leave the rest untouched!