Nazi warlocks.

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Can anybody tell me about Hitler's obsession with the cult?I read on one article that he searched for some spear with magical powers.I'm beginning to think that Hitler killed the jews for some other reason....

 

Well, it is believed that Hitler got syphilis from a Jewish prostitute.

Goebbel's (Hitler's propaganda man) wife knew much about the occult and about the Aryan "ubermenscter". Hitler used those occult ideas to promote the idea of the Teutonic Aryan man who was superior to the "inferior" Jews, Gypsies, etc. And his symbol, the Swatsika was associated with power and the like.

 

Even if this matter can be considered as a conspiracy theory, there are some facts, which indicate that Hitler and some other high ranking nazi officers like Himmler and Hess were involved in occult. Some of this facts are:
- The theory of aryan race seems to come from the books of the occultist Helena Blavatsky and especially from her book "The Secret Doctrine".
- The nazi party used symbols, which can be considered occult and magical (swastika, runes).
- The roots of the nazi party were in an occult organization called "Thule", which has the swastika as its symbol too.
- The SS were organised by Himmler with the standards of Templar Knights.
- Hitler and Hess were obsessed with astrology. Some sources claim that Hitler delayed the attack against Soviet Union because his personal astrologer advised him to do so.

There are many books written on this subject as well as many internet sites dedicated to it, if you want to read more about it, but prepare to read lot of crap.

As for the spear, it was the spear of Longinus and it seems that it was one of Hitler's obsessions.

 

The spear of Longinus was the spear which stabbed Jesus when he was crucified, the soldier wielding it was named (surprise!!) Longinus.
The rumours about being magical started somewhere with Constantine the Great.

It´s even said that the upper layer of the SS was the "13 of Longinus", which was made up of Himmler and his 12 most trusted lieutenants answering only to the Führer

 

I know nothing about Hitler's search for the Spear of St.Longinus (yes, he is a saint) but he was indeed deeply involved in occultism. Swastika (hackenkreuz) is a prehistorical-to-ancient symbol of sun and sometimes life and as such was adopted by Nazis. I would be cautious about that reference to Knights Templar though. In some ways Hitler took certain ideas after Teutonic Knights that were both inherently German and oriented on the expansion of German race. Templars were highly mystical and heavily influenced by orient, but in fact they had nothing to do with occultism. The hierarchy that may look familiar was almost identical in all chivalric orders, so again Teutonic Knights are more likely here as a closer option, ethnically and ideologically.

As for the reason why he killed Jews... look on his face? See something special? Right. The mother of his mother was a Jewish woman. He killed in a way the part of himself that he didn't enjoy.

[ January 05, 2003, 18:51: Message edited by: chevalier des Trois-Tours ]

 

The so called Teutonic Knights, the Deutsche Ritterorden, was not so much busy with expanding the teutonic race - the idea of an ayran race was not even there at their time. Instead they colonized and especially christianized the pagan slavic east around the batic sea and below, the areas of poland, the baltic states, belorus and even western russia. As with most colonists, they were not too polular with the local population.

The Deutsche Ritterorden strongly inspired the Nazis though, who eagerly reinterpreted their efforts of christianisation in the east as a teutonic struggle to dominate minor races - which is not only historically incorrect but also complete nonsense. Nontheless the Deutsche Ritterorden, knight orders in general, indeed inspired the creators of the SS.

Hitler himself was strongly inspired by the austrian antisemitic literature of his youth days - namely some dude named Dr. Lanz von der Liebenfels, a fallen monk, who published an antisemitic magazine named Ostara which Hitler quite probably read. In this remarkable magazine he reflected about the fate of superior races, the minor races, not neglecting things such as ayran ass-forms and foot-patterns (no joke).

A psychiatrist who later had opportunity to speak him, identified strong *pathological traits* in his opinions anout an ayran race. He also stated that Liebenfels complained, half proud, that Hitler had used his ideas without naming him as his menthor - so he saw himself.
Liebenfels also founded a so-called order of Knights (forgot the exact name) in a castle he somehow aquired. Knight orders must have fascinated the antisimitic racists of that time. As with Hitler, Liebenfels very much *lived* in his own world of ideas of an *ayran race*, which eventually led to the classification of Liebenfels beeing pathological.

Seemingly this is the only kind of insanity that is infectious. It is actually a sobering thought that struggling germany eventually found itself to be led and raped by a horde of foaming lunatics.

 

Well, I not exactly agree. Semi-scientific 'race' as we see it today not really and certainly they wouldn't rather use the term although it's quite an ancient one. But so called 'element' yes. There is evidence of such a distinction early in 14th century in Europe and probably earlier as well. I suppose a French order would favour French colonists, an Italian one Italian ones and so on, so nothing really special about this. Well, for normal people of course, not for those who actually seek patterns they have set in stone in their minds, like Nazi ideologists. Troubles arise at the moment that the Order starts converting sword in hand already converted tribes and communities as well as colonising already colonised lands, but it's nothing to do with Hitler. Ah, and you've gone too far geographically and chronologically I fear - Teutonic Knights had nothing to do with christianising Poland. This was done by Czech clergy beginning from the year 966. Royals and nobles had converted until the year 1000 (Otto III's pilgrimage to the tomb of St.Adalbert). By 12th century all remnants of pagan religion had been totally extinguished. The Order was given a feud by prince Conrad of Masovia in the year 1226 and not until late 13th century had that branch become more numerous than up to twenty full members, so it's quite later in time. I don't suppose it's being taught in schools but can be checked in any encyclopedia, honestly.

Sorry for going off-topic.

[ January 05, 2003, 22:23: Message edited by: chevalier des Trois-Tours ]

 

Templar Knights were accused of practicing occult rituals and worshiping Baphomet and their last leader, Jacque De Molais, was burned alive. Also, there were suspicions that they had connections with the heresy of Algevines in Southern France. SS took from them some elements, which did not exist in other Knight orders (Waffen SS were not allowed to retreat, unless they were outnumbered in 1vs3 analogy and this was a Templars'rule) .Teutonic knights were used as well but mostly as propaganda tool.

Also, Hitler was not jew. Himmler has this suspicion too and he investigated this story but he didn't find proofs. There is one theory, which supports that Hitler hated jews because his mother died when she was under the supervision of a jew doctor.

There is a spear, which is believed to be the spear of Longinus, in Hofburg museum in Vienna. Hitler took it after the "Ansluss" and after the end of the war it was found by Americans and it was returned to the museum.

 

Well, those occult accusations were a standard point. They were forged together with mock proof by the notorious Guillaume de Nogaret for Phillip IV the Fair of France in the year 1307 when the trial started. Sodomy and apostasy were also included. Together this is the must-have three in nearly all political trials in mediaeval era. They were so boring they couldn't think up anything new and this perfectly worked, so it was repeated all the time until everyone knew it was a facade only. As far as Templars are concerned no evidence has been found till present. The Baphomet thing is simply 'Mahomet' or 'Muhammad' pronounced by some peasant. 'Baphoma country' was a common name of Syria in Scotland and North England due to similar reasons.

Numerous parts of Templar Strictures were based on the number three. This is indeed sort of astrological figure apart from traditional Christian Trinity symbolic, Old Testament references, Greek and Keltic triadas. St. Bernard of Clairvaux sort of liked threes as well.

Templars weren't also allowed to fight Christians unless three times attacked previously

 

Templar orders following the Rule-of-Threes. Lol!

 

Not really laughable... There are indeed many things grouped in threes in their Strictures. When I have the time I could send in some quotes or translate what I have into English. Ah, but let's set the record straight: I'm not saying they're involved in magical threes - as I reserved above And it's nothing to do with Kant as well.

[ January 06, 2003, 16:33: Message edited by: chevalier des Trois-Tours ]

 

I wasn't quite exact about the Deutscher Ritterorden, the with the Maltese Knights and Templars most important knight order, and to some point your corrections were right. A brief overview:

Founded during the crusades in 1190 in the seiged city of Akko as a hospital order by citizens of the cities of Lübeck and Bremen. In 1198 they turned into a knight order to protect pilgrims in the holy land, their sign beeing the white coat with a black cross. Their primary efforts were then aimed on fighting the muslims in palestine. When they lost their ground there they eventually moved to Venice, and, searching a new task, to Marienburg in western prussia, now part of poland. They got the Culmer Land as a reward from Konrad I. of Masovia for their efforts in fighting the then pagan prussians. That made their high Master Hermann von Salza lay the foundament for the proud Ordensstaat, a land ruled by the order alone.
In 1237 they united with the smaller order of the Brothers of the Sword and a got a foothold in Livland, now part of the baltic countries, and christianized Latvia with fire and sword.

A powerful order could not long stay without rivals. As a result of united rule over Poland and Latvia (as a result of war or marriage) in 1386 hostilities between the order and poland developed. On 15.6.1410 the order lost in a battle at Tannenberg against the polish and had to give up territories to the polish in two peace treaties made in Thorn.
As a result of this they also lost support with the german hanseatic guild and eventually became unimportant until Napoleon eventually dissolved the order. Later there was a brief revival in Austria afterwards but without any further importance.

Left as a sign of their former power and pride are their highly remarkable castles, namely the magnificent Marienburg.
http://www.ost-preussen.de/ostpr/marienb.htm (unfortunately a german pahge, with good pics though)

[ January 06, 2003, 17:27: Message edited by: Ragusa ]

 

In 1226 the Knights were invited to take small land as a feud and then rule what they conquer under the Duke Konrad's sovereign authority given free hand in internal administration as usual in such cases in Spain for example. The Duke Konrad wanted a small body of knights similar to Templar, Hospitallier and Calatrava detachments about 20 knights each that he had already installed in his dutchy, but the Grand Master von Salza had a somewhat different view on the subject and so had the Emperor Frederick (indirectly in Rimini Bull) . The Knights soon gained de facto independence and although illegitimately, but were treated as a sovereign state by European powers from 1309 when the castle of Marienburg was erected by the order of the Grand Master Siegfried von Feuchtwangen and a year after the Order took a vast part of Pomerania from Poland preserving the fiction of 'eternal charity' or however it is English (the meaning was that the Polish King still owned the land with the legal title but the Order possessed and ruled it).

The union between Poland and Lithuania was forged when they finally realised their fighting had been pointless. After Tannenberg, 15.7.1410 the Order didn't have to give much land as Polish politicians and diplomats totally screwed up the negotations and the Pope intervened as well. After the Thirteen Years War 1454-1467 Poland regained the lands lost in 1308 as well as took Marienburg and Warmia and the Grand Masters beginning from Ludwig von Erlichshausen moved to Konigsberg (now Kalliningrad) and had to acknowledge Polish sovereignty. Friedrich von Sachsen was not quite happy with that (some small struggle) and when in 1519 Albrecht von Hohenzollern-Ansbach (Sigmund I of Poland's nephew) declined openly the last war started that ended early in 1521. As it's usual in Poland negotiations took twice longer than the war itself. In 1525 exit the Grand Master Albrecht, enter the Duke Albrecht as the ruler of the vassal state of Prussia and a faithful Lutherian. What's next is the history of Prussia and of the Order in Mergentheim and then Vienna. The first is irrelevant here and I believe only hobbists are interested in the latter, so I now end the story.

 

Somewhat back on the subject of Nazi Warlocks - although the History of Chivalry lesson has been truly interesting (really, I'm being sincere here, guys!) - has anyone read the novel "The Magic Circle" by Katherine Neville? An interesting combination of psuedo-history, occultism, and thriller. It takes Hitler's obsession with the occult and spins an enjoyable story. Much lighter than "Foucault's Pendulum" by Umberto Eco.