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Neverwinter Nights 2 Forum News (Nov. 4, 04)

Discussion in 'Game/SP News & Comments' started by chevalier, Nov 4, 2004.

  1. chevalier

    chevalier Knight of Everfull Chalice ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran

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    Here are today's Neverwinter Nights 2 forum highlights, collected by NWVault from Obsidian Forums. Please take into account that these are only single parts of various threads and should not be taken out of context. Bear in mind also that the posts presented here are copied as-is, and that any bad spelling and grammar does not get corrected on our end.

    Brian Lawson, Graphics Programming

    NWN2 Game Engines
    How will Electron compare to Unreal Engine 3.0?
    Let's be realistic here...shall we? UE 3 is the evolution of an engine (primarily graphics) over the last DECADE. That's a LOT of time and a LOT of refining. Although, that's NOT to say that what we're doing isn't as cool in it's own unique way. Every game has its own needs when it comes to a graphics engine and the one plus for us, is that we've now been able to progam the engine to specifically meet OUR needs.

    I can say that at this point (which really only amounts to what? about 14 weeks worth of work) we do have some of the same features implemented that you'll find in UE 3. All things considered and at this EARLY stage of the game, we find that to be extremely exciting.

    NWN2 Textures
    As I understand, the whole graphics engine is being rewritten from scratch for NWN2 so chances are this problem will be addressed, but I felt the need to raise it nonetheless.
    You make a vaild point. You are also correct in that the graphics engine is brand new from the ground up. While the problem that you specifically point out hasn't been specifically addressed yet, I can say that with the new system I don't think swapping the textures on a particular model will be a problem.

    More:
    sounds great Brian, just sucks that so many features are still up in the air
    Yeah, I relaize that it sucks for you guys in terms of not knowing what's up. But I must say that after only 14 weeks of work, we are humming along on this end. Ultimately, that translates into GOOD things for you guys

    Editing Models in Ascii
    Will we be able to view and edit the files in a text editor as we are able to do now? Currently, NWN models are converted from ASCII whenever applicable, which was (I think) deliberately built into the graphics engine so that it would be easier for Custom Content creators to figure them out. I could be wrong about that, but I can't see why else they would bother to put that extra step into in-game model rendering. Anyway, since the graphics engine is changing, and since I know that this extra conversion step slowed the processing down (a very, very little), will it be done away with?
    Actually, I believe there are still plans to support loading models from both binary AND ascii. I write all of the loading code and while most of our new stuff is currently being loaded via a binary loading routine, there are place holders for ascii loading routines as well.

    One thing to keep in mind though, is that with the new graphics engine comes a LOT of new technology at least as far as NWN graphics are concerned. As such (which has always traditionally been the case), the only place to store all of the data associated with models etc is in a file. Meaning that while ascii loading will most likely be supported, you can most definitely expect the complexity of an ascii file to increase.

    I guess I'm not 100% sure how I feel about this (allowing user tweaks to ascii files) because a lot of the new data will not be as forgiving to hand made tweaks as it was in the past. I guess the best example of this will be skinned mesh data. Those vertices are placed in a very specific manner so that the skeleton they were skinned around deforms them as desried. You can only imagine after having exported the file to ascii and then attempting to go in and manually tweak vertices...that's only asking for a dorked up mesh. Now for simple things like changing texture names, etc, THAT kind of stuff makes sense. But with the new system I find it hard to think of anything off the top of my head that would greatly benefit from hand tweaking.

    More:
    Well, Brian, what I do most often is steal whole nodes from one model and insert them directly into another model... it's very simple using the ASCII editing to cut, copy and paste whole nodes. You just have to edit the parent name and perhaps the location and orientation parameters. I think this will actually be an important work-around for making new models without needing to go through the painfully hard process of making new (high poly!!) model nodes from scratch. Thanks a bunch for your detailed response.
    That's what I was afraid of. I think people who are used to modding the original NWN are not yet very clear on just how significantly things have/are changing with the graphics engine. No longer will you be able to simply copy and paste a node (there are no nodes anymore) that was intended for use with one character into another character. The reason for this is that we're now using real skeletons and skinned meshes that have their vertices tied and weighted to specific bones within a specific skeleton if that makes any sense. It's difficult to explain without being able to sit down with a modelling package and simply show you exactly what I'm talking about.

    Even with reuse of skeletons between meshes (which won't always be possible) you still won't be able to take the arm (for example) from one character and place it onto another. The reason for this is that unless both of their meshes were skinned in exactly the same way with all vertices between the two using all of the exact same bones and weights per vertex, it will look messed up. I guess that's why I originally questioned the whole need for ascii editing this go around. All of the customization stuff will be handled with the tool this time (or at least that's my understanding of the goal). I think when it's all said and done, you'll be very happy with the amount of customization that is empowered to you as a user.

    More:
    yes, very good information. I know you can't give a deffinate at this point, but will you be considering creating a model converter or a user level version of your modelling package for us to make our own models?
    Shadow, all I can say for now is that there are plans to provide end users with the ability to eventually create/edit their own characters/meshes and then get them into the game. Whether or not that is something that will ship with the game or come out later I honestly can't say because I honestly don't know.

    Ferret, Developer

    Expectations
    Most projects get announced later in their life cycle than NWN2. When the developers talk then, they are more certain as to the ultimate shape of the game because they've already made huge chunks of it. We're shipping in 2006 and so there is considerable time between now and then. Just brace yourself, because I'm sure some features we've talked about won't be in. But I'm guessing a high percentage of them will. We try and preface our posts carefully will qualifiers, but even if we slip up and forget a "We're hoping" please go easy on us.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 3, 2018
    chevalier, Nov 4, 2004
    #1
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