Nobel Peace Prize to Jailed Chinese System Critic

Good for the Peace prize committee.

Interesting response by China. China wants as much information as they can get its hands on when it comes to technology and designs, but news is not available for its population.

 

Lets the Chinese know what the rest of the world thinks of its rather repressive policies. Of course, the Chinese powers that be already know, and they don't give a flying . . . . at a rolling doughnut. This is unlikely to change that attitude.

 

I found the Chinese choice of words interesting. "Blasphemy", eh? So they're going back to the whole "the Government is God" thing? And here I thought they were trying to be good, atheistic communists.

 

I think the main problem is that yes, there is dissent in China but either it is extremely surpressed (a real possibility) or not very widespread.

The Chinese do not have freedom but they have stability and a government that is reasonably benevolent as long as you do not speak out against them too much. I think China is a real challenge to the concept of democracy. The Chinese government are slowly pulling more than a billion people out of poverty. I was watching a documentary about the Tianamen massacre a while ago and it wasn't the one sided affair I thought it was even if the end result was an atrocity. The Chinese government held back and tried diplomacy for days before sending in the troops.

The problem for Chinese dissenters is that they do not seem to have much support and that the government isn't a bunch of draconic semi-psychotic dictators that we are used to in totalitarian countries. From what I can gather China isn't so much a totalitarian dictatorship as a pragmacy (new word made by me meaning ruled by pragmatism). A bunch of bureaucrats are in charge trying to do what is best for the country as a whole. China isn't a homogenous entity and "freedom" could very well lead to the collapse of the entire country with different ethnicities duking it out Yugoslavia style.

China vividly demonstrates the conflict between freedom and stability and a true challenge to our democratic ideals. China can pursue long term policies, the government is not in thrall to fickle public opinion. I must admit that I am fascinated by China and very curious to see how things play out. As long as the people are supplied with economic growth and the hope that their children will have a better life I cannot see anything changing.

 

Considering that it was once reported that China has more civil unrest than any other nation I'll wager repression is used.

Note that repression is not "good" for its people and one of the major ways China pursues its economic growth is through a lack of environmental and labor laws (also not good for its people).

Yes China can pursue long term goals-economic growth, military upgrades, and increased political influence.

China, to some extent, has been embracing the same foreign policy that the US earned some criticism for before-buddying up to tyrants/dictators and human rights violators.... and it is not like they have the Cold War as an excuse that this is a necessary evil.

Also China may not be very good for the planet at the moment as, at one of the times when the US is willing to start moving forwards on Global Warming (thanks to Obama), China is opting to nix deals that would at least attempt (that may not even be strong enough) to deal with it.

And ignoring the "fickle" public opinions of the populace may be a good short term thing when it comes to putting together a long range plan-but it can lead to a number of bad things so it may be penny smart and pound foolish.

While there is a lot of truth that many people are being raised out of poverty in China there is also a huge wealth divide there. So China's embrace of capitalism may simply result in a larger divide between rich and poor than has been witnessed in any major power this, or last, century.

China's safety net is being shrunk rather than grown so the benefits of Communism (everyone has food and a job) are arguably less likely to be promised to the population.

China may be a challenge to our democratic ideals but with several negatives.

They could be wrong but some China watchers suggest that China, if faced with the choice of loosing economic growth or loosing political control would would opt for the former. Now maybe a new generation of leaders will allow a slow growth of democracy, at the moment, that appears to be stalled-instead leaving a psuedo-capitalist oligarchy.


Now you did mention ethnicity and I thought it was interesting that you did. Correct me if I'm wrong but China has a majority but not uniform ethnic group. Perhaps not that different from here in the USA.

But being multi-ethnic is something the USA and UK have managed to deal with without tensions (sure there are some) exploding into a Yugoslavia. I suspect one of the reason European nations have difficulty dealing with immigration is because they are more ethnically focused/homogenized.

Also note that some of what happened in Yugoslavia tore apart where there was good multi-ethic relations (a warning to us of things to watch for perhaps) with plenty of mutual respect and intermarriage. But who said the ugly side of tribalism can get pretty cruel and illogical (to the point where it is killing off partial members of its own). This was not inevitable but it was possible after being stirred up-one more reason to encourage people not to embrace tribalism so much.

 

My impression of modern China is that it really is much like ancient China. Brutal dictatorship which, thougha combination of a pursuit of what is better for the governing rather than the governed, and a very conscious awareness of just how bad a peasant uprising can be, has produced a remarkably stable government. Not a fair one, or even a nice one, but it's a system that served ancient China well for thousands of years.

In effect, despite all the Red Communist paint and Mao's Little Red Book and the National Party and all, the communist revolution in China may have been more of a changing of the guard than a radical change in government. Same taxes and corrupt lackeys, new faces.

 

I'm not so sure. A professor who held a seminar on human rights in China stated that especially in the rural areas there are several riots a year that would hit the headlines in most western countries but no one hears of them because the information outflow is so tightly controlled by the government, and the Uighur region in China is a completely different matter and bordering on the state of war.