Online Reactions

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I would like to get your opinions on something, considering that we have a wide and varied crowd here. I've been playing an MMO and have been involved in a faction (basically, guild) in it for a few months. I've gotten to know the people in this faction (pretty small) fairly well. The faction runs a weekly event called Hide and Seek, where one person hides in the world and puts clues to their location in faction chat. Here's the situation:

I decided to try my hand at hiding. The first two hiding places and clues went well. I may have been a little tough to find, but that was accepted. For the third location, I had decided to use two Bible passages that would reference in-game locations: Mark 15 for a place called the Mountain of the Skull, and Psalm 23 for a place called the Valley of Death. One of the faction members, who wasn't participating in the event, took great offense to me using Bible references in my clues, and basically accused me of forcing my beliefs down everyone's throats. She left the faction over this. Prior to this point, I hadn't been terribly vocal about my beliefs, but I had mentioned them occasionally, including to this woman, and had never had any negative reactions.

My question is, what happened? Was I unsensitive, or was she over-sensitive? Would you be deeply offended if someone made casual reference to a text that you didn't believe in during an unofficial MMO event?

 

She overreacted. There's no way that simply referring to any work of literature is an attempt to force belief on someone. I know some people out there believe that even mentioning the Bible in conversation is tantamount to conversion by the sword, but they are a small minority.

 

Well, there was one bit when someone said they didn't know anything about the Bible, and I said they could find an online Bible and look up the relevant passages easily. I didn't think anything of it at the time, as I would have said the same for anything that wasn't a built-in part of the game. I also didn't criticize anyone for not knowing the Bible, or in any way suggest that they HAD to participate, or egg anyone on who wanted to quite (actually, they all seemed rather interested, if stumped).

 

It could be seen as you taking a sneaky and roundabout way of spreading the gospel. I wouldnt be offended but I would quit participating at that time and would forever look at you as a weirdo.

 

There are a few extinuating factors you would need to elaborate on first:

Is this a fantasy setting or historic? For a historic setting a biblical reference should be acceptable. In a fantasy setting the use of religious material is usually not considered very good form -- you are either equating the religion with fantasy or pushing religion on others (I knew a guy who played clerics of "Jesus Christ" in D&D games because he refuse to "put any other gods before Him").

How are clues normally given? If people are giving clues which are descriptive (though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death) and you use only "Psalms 23:4" or worse Psalms 23, then I'd say she has a legitimate complaint. Especially if you are forcing member to read entire sections of the bible to find your clue.​

Religion is a sensitive subject. In an MMO you should stick with the religions of the MMO (and keep real religions out of it). I was playing D&D in the "early days" when many religions would spout propaganda about how evil the game was. I think religion and gaming do not mix unless everyone at the proverbial table is the same religion.

 

Well, religion can be a touchy subject all by itself; for the people that seek to bash some demon skulls, indiscriminately kill innocents or - gasp - club some seal cubs into submission, even more so. They do it for fun, and the mere thought of having someone pull the Bible Dude stunt in the middle of this "sinful enjoyment" is confronted with a nerd rage.

But yes, that ex-faction member of yours has some issues. I haven't quite figured out which I'm more uncomfortable with - blind zealotry or irrational hate for anything even remotely religious. I certainly don't accept either. "Kill all the fanatics!"

 

The only thing I'd be annoyed at is your clues would require a signifcant amount of reading. Mark 15 and Psalm 23 would require quite a bit of reading, especially for someone who has no interest in reading the bible. Moreover, if someone is not familiar with the Bible, then they might not even know what Mark 15 refers to. Still I'd have to say that while using a religious reference may be considered BM to an extent, I'd say the woman over-reacted. A simple request that you not use religious references in the future probably would have been a more appropriate response.

 

T2, the setting is fantasy, but this is one of those MMOs with essentially no story at all. I've never heard of anyone role-playing anything in the entire game, there are no RP sections on the forums. The passages were cited in a riddle, so it's not like I just set them out there, but I did kind of expect them to at least skim the passages. These weren't long passages either. No more than a couple of sentences. Still, I did expect them to read it.

Aldeth, I admit that, in retrospect, my clues were a little obscure and not really fitted to the audience (I hadn't even thought that they may not know that Golgotha means Hill of the Skull until I had already posted the riddle), but I think that was a technical issue, and not one that would cause anyone offense.

 

I agree. I think she over-reacted. The only thing I would add, is that if a Muslim player left clues that were hidden in the Koran, would you be willing to look them up, or would it annoy you? I would not complain, but I probably wouldn't bother to look for him.

 

Chandos, this is why I'm confused. I'd look them up. Actually, my wife and I even have a translation of the Koran (I know, us heathens have translated it ) and I have read it.

 

She must have been so intent on being the one to find you in the game, that she was forced to open a bible and read some of it. Now, if you're like me...such activities cause an intense burning sensation in the eyes and any part of the body that comes in physical contact with the afore mentioned book. Upset stomach, headache, and nausea are also common.

However, she *could* have decided to give up the chase...but then again, no one likes to be a loser.

 

People get annoyed when they get religion broadcasted in their face alot. Alot of people arn`t interested in hearing about it-or have anything to do with it. Maybe especially not when playing a game, and wanting to relax and disconect. Same goes for having peoples sexuality being shoved in their face too, I suppose. However; in this case, the chic did over-react. Thats for sure.

 

NOG, I think the problem is that (please correct me if I'm wrong) you made them look the passages up. Had you simply posted the passages -- a circuitous enough clue on its own -- I doubt there would have been a problem.

While I don't believe you did anything wrong, I see this as one of those intent vs. appearances issues that we encounter from time. You weren't intending to proselytize, or "rub your religion in other people's faces," but I'm sure you can understand how some people could construe it that way. Such an interpretation may be unreasonable, but people aren't always (or even usually) reasonable.

 

I'm guessing this is Mission Impossible I stuff, I remember them using bible quotes in the film? You can certainly use the Bible and other stuff as the basis for all kinds of hokum, like the Da Vinci code. Not advocating blasphemy here but religions are full of all kinds of cool sounding phrases or stories. I bet the woman wouldn't have been offended if you used classical Greek gods, as that's not a 'real' religion anymore.

I suppose it would get annoying if you felt somebody was trying to push their religion. Everyone around where I am is of the same faith so there's not too much point in preaching. Maybe this woman is from somewhere where she sticks out and has people on to her the whole time? Still, it sounds like a big overreaction if you're not in the habit of doing stuff like this.

 

I'm an atheist, but I think that biblical references in that kind of thing is super interesting! I use biblical references all the time, especially when trying to prove a point about something; the book is packed full of symbolism and references to everyday situations.

But, to get back on topic, I think that she over reacted to quite a degree. I mean lets be real here, they use The Bible on jeopardy for clues, and no one is claiming that Alex Trebek is trying to slam religion on us.

 

Nog, you did nothing wrong IMO. Yes, the bible is a religious text - but it's also the most-read book on the planet. I can't imagine anyone would get offended had you referenced chapters in Harry Potter books. I think your clues were quite clever, actually.

You always take a chance in bringing anything related to religion into a categorically non-religious activity. Some people feel preached to even by bringing it up at all, since if they were interested in church matters they'd go to church – this online game (like all hobbies) can be an escape of sorts from work, school, even religion. I would agree that this girl's reaction was way over the top, but that's not to say others in the group didn't – or would not have – reacted negatively while choosing not to make a scene. Best rule of thumb for me is along the same lines as not asking people how much they make: even when the subject is innocently broached, it's still in bad taste.

Still, your clues were not preaching - just referencing a widely-known text. You're in the right.

 

Unfortunately, Drew, quoting the passages would have given it right away. The clue would have ended up: Draw a line from THIS PLACE through THAT PLACE and follow it until it ends.

 

Some people are very aware of all the harm the bible has done to humanity over the years, and see it for what I see it: A work of bronze/iron age fiction, mixed with some astrology, written by people obsessed with cruelty and death, and used to avoid taking responsibility for acts of despicable violence, even atrocities, over the ages. {this is bound to provoke reactions, but notice that I worded it so as to make clear that it is my opinion, which I have a right to}
With that in mind, this person may have a hard time stomaching your spreading-the-good-word in her free time. She'd feel barred from participating in a very engaging pastime, because she vows to avoid this terrible book at any cost. I agree that she overreacted*, but it's understandable: She had warned you in advance that the bible wasn't appreciated, and you persisted to take over her 'faction' by forcing your offensive literature into the group. She left because you two cannot coexist in this online group peacefully.
As for who is to blame...(who am I to judge, but I will) Well, she did take insult where others would have let it pass, but I admire her principle for this. You should feel at least partly responsible IMO, because it was your actions that caused the antagonism. But it's nothing worth losing sleep over, as I'm sure you won't.

* BTW, you shouldn't criticise her for taking offense. Everyone has their own particular strings, and if you pull a wrong one, you get a violent response. Think of road rage, or what happens if you snatch food out of someone's hands.