POLL: Societal vs. Personal Views on Abortion

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Chandros' comment in my other poll got me thinking of this, as his views are similar to mine: Namely, that while I would never want to have a woman abort a child where I am the father, I still support the right of other women to differ from my opinion and have an abortion.

Some ground rules for the poll: In most westerns societies, the decision to have an abortion lies solely with the woman. So for the men in the poll, I'm obviously assuming that you would have some say in the matter - i.e., that your opinion would be valued by whomever you happened to get pregnant. It's true that no man can force a woman to get an abortion or prevent a woman from getting an abortion if she does not agree, but for simplcity sake, let's just say that she would share whatever your views are.

For women it's obvious, as you WOULD have the responsibility of making the decision, so you can interpret the question literally.

Last ground rule: To not muddy the waters, we will assume that the pregnancy resulted from consensual sex between two adults. We are not considering abortion in the case where rape or incest is involved, the female is a minor, or in cases where the mother's life would be in grave danger if she attempted to carry the baby to term. So in other words - typical pregnancies where a husband/boyfriend gets his wife/girlfriend pregnant.

Poll Information
This poll contains 1 question(s). 30 user(s) have voted.
You may not view the results of this poll without voting.

Poll Results: Societal vs. Personal Views on Abortion (30 votes.)

My philosophy on abortion can best be described as: (Choose 1)
* I would consider abortion for myself (or my wife/gf), and I support the right of women to chose to have abortions. - 47% (14)
* I would never consider an abortion for myself (or my wife/gf), but I still support the right of others to chose to have an abortion. - 23% (7)
* I would not consider abortion for myself (or my wife/gf), and I do not support the right for women to chose to have abortions. - 30% (9)
* I would consider abortion for myself (or my wife/gf), but I do not support the right for women to have abortions (which seems logically inconsistent, but it's a choice). - 0% (0)

 

I went for the second option. Its only the woman involved decision, however I think women should be assured of fanincial and emotional help from family/friends/government to deter aborting the baby. I think this would cut down on abortion rates by a lot.

Most women feel helpless when they are pregnant unexpectantly.

In terms of rape, no woman should be condemned for seeking an abortion. I can only imagine how this would feel, and I would have not right to suggest otherwise.

 

I guess another aspect that this poll brings out is it is possible to be personally Pro-Life, but societally Pro-Choice.

 

I went with #3 -- I don't see abortion in terms of the woman's choice, I see it as an inherently wrong decision that should not be made available as a societally sanctioned choice (ie: Suicide is a choice, so is infanticide or something similar, but these are not choices sanctioned by most modern societies)

That said, I feel for the women who have made that choice, and I don't harbour any negative feelings for them. Just because I don't agree with a behaviour doesn't mean I hate or despise the person.

 

I always confuse "Support" with "encourage"... Made almost a mistake in my decision.

I, like dmc, would support and advocate, abortion if my wife was in (serious) danger. That would be option #1.

If we are not talking about danger to (both) the mother (and child), I would not encourage abortion at all. Supporting would be different. I can't tell people what to do or not, but I think it would be #3.

 

#2 for me - to quote Aldeth, personally pro-life but societallyy pro-choice.

What I do is my choice, mine and mine alone - and I will not pressure others to make the same choice; their choice, too, is theirs alone as well. So, I am pro-choice.

*looks at what she just wrote*

That doesn't really make sense, but oh well.

 

Personally, life begins at conception, but the libertarian in me will not allow me to force that view upon others. I do think that in the case described, abortion is an easy out, and is a pretty poor moral choice. If a couple decides to engage in a risky activity, and they end up with a child, they should take responsibility for their actions and bring that life to its full fruition. There are a lot of people who want to adopt newborns, and will even pay for the costs of the pregnancy. To me it is morally weak to have an abortion in the case where there are no more than the normal risks of pregnancy (the only safe pregnancy is the one where the child was born and no harm resulted, there is always a risk in being pregnant). It says to me that "I don't want this child, but I am not strong enough to give him/her up if he/she is carried to term, so I will kill him/her so that I don't have to either keep and support him/her, or deal with the emotional pain of giving him/her up after birth".

That said, I appose making first trimester abortions illegal. Informed consent, and parental consent (in the case of a minor) are BIG issues with me however.

 

I don't like abortion but I do view that it's the woman's right to have abortion. If for some reason I would get a woman pregnant and she would ask me for guidance to what she should choose I would never ever recommend abortion. I simply could not live with myself if it did something to her. Even if there is a coward in me which would be extremely tempted to scream out "Yes, do it! So we'll both be free from the responsibility!" it would just feel so wrong. So I am not fond of abortion but I do consider it to be every woman's right to abort her pregnancy if it's done within the required time. However men who demand a woman to have an abortion are nothing more than irresponsible cowards.

 

My reasoning:

Premises:

1. A foetus is alive, human in nature and separate from the mother.
2. A being is alive and separate from other beings.
3. To have an abortion is to terminate the existence of a foetus.
4. To commit homicide is to terminate the existence of a human being.

Conclusion:

1. A foetus is a human being.

Thesis:

1. To have an abortion is to terminate the existence of a human being and therefore to commit homicide.

As homicide is not an individual matter but a social one, I therefore believe that to have an abortion is not an individual choice but something that affects the society as a whole. Therefore, I can't support the idea of individuals having a say here.

Note: This doesn't mean that I believe the society has any right to allow abortion, such as by making it legal. The society has no claim on the lives of those who have committed no crime except when it's necessary to defend the country.

 

A: I would consider abortion for myself (or my wife/gf), and I support the right of women to chose to have abortions.

Option B says never. This is too absolute to be acceptable for me.
The fact that the woman's health comes first has been said before. But economic considerations are also an important factor here. Unlike in the more developed countries, India does not have a mode of institutional child support. When a couple recognise that a new child wil be detrimental to their efforts to raise a child in the manner which it deserves, they would consider abortion. Ofcourse, the guy should have been intelligent enough to use condoms or take a more permanent measures.

Assuming that a pregnancy should be carried to term and then given up for adoption is stupid imo. If you cannot take personal responsibility for your actions, how can you want nameless others to do the same? How do you know that you are not condeming the child to a life of pain. And how would you explain your actions? That for some inane reason you wouldn't consider abotion but decided to leave a child without the support and care of a family!
Life is a big responsibility and you should shoulder it.

 

Shrikant,

Perhaps in India that is the way things are, and perhaps my views were to regionalized, but in America, we have agencies that will match up pregnant mothers with someone who wants to adopt a newborn, do background checks and verify that people are well adjusted and financially capable of taking care of a child, and often times the pregnant woman can meet, and even have a relationship with the future parents of her child. This doesn't guarantee that the child won't be mistreated, but at least the child doesn't end up dead, and the odds are in his/her favor have a good life. I think you are envisioning a drop off at an orphanage.

 

That is your exception to the rule of "homicide." Others may have different ones (death penalty, for instance). Others have no exceptions to homicide. The Quakers are an example of the no exceptions to God's law of "thou shalt not kill."

Yet, many don't consider abortion "homicide." While others don't consider dropping a bomb from an airplane onto an innocent child homicide either. Pick and choose...

 

The assumption in the question lead me to understand that the sex was consentual, that she was leagally old enough, not related, and not in imminent danger. By this, then To abort the pregnancy would be murder.

If I have consentual sex, then I am responsible for the consequences. If the woman is impregnated, then I take part of the responsibility for that child. I wuold thus do whatever was necessary to persuede her to have the baby and do my best to support her and the child. This is my responsibility. If this sounds ridiculous to you, then you have no business having sex.

Even in the four cases that were excluded, whether to abort or not are to be based on faith. If the woman was raped, there would be no fault on her for aborting, but it would not be forced. Likewise if she was under age. Incest again, forced or not, may grant rights to abort, but it will not be forced. I've heard of cases where a woman's health was endangered and it looked like the baby would be lost. Mother and child are both alive and well.

I'll take this question a step further. Suppose a Friend had consentual sex with another man. She were to become pregnant. For whatever reason, the father wouldn't be in the picture (irrelevent for discussion). I would even step in to help the woman through this trying time. I believe that is the right thing to do (Matthew 25:40 states that "Inasmuch as ye have done it unto the least of these, my brethren, ye have done it unto me.")

 

I don't believe in abortion and don't believe that women should have the right either. Of course, there is a grey area where the mother's health is at risk. But otherwise it's no to both.

You choose to have sex, you face the consequences. Give the child up for adoption if you can't handle the reponsibility. There are many couples out there who desperately want a child. You can do the same for rape cases. In most cases, I believe that abortion is bailing out on your responsibilities. You're protecting your good name, cashflow or lifestyle at the expense of a defenseless child.

I have mentioned in another thread that my mother chose to have me even if life would be difficult for her. I honor her love and courage by choosing life. This was not a choice in my head. I actually had to choose, twice, both unexpectedly. I am in no way belittling the opinions of those who have no real experience in these situations but being in the situation is really different. The first time I was to be a father, I was very apprehensive but I later accepted the situation and started looking forward to my child's birth. Unfortunately my daughter was born six months into the pregnancy. She lived for 12 hours. She was a little over a pound and she could fit in my hands. She breathed her last in those hands. My grief was incredible. I can't even imagine how parents who lose children who have been with them ten, twenty or more years, feel. She would have been five now and probably taking ballet lessons. I still miss her.

A year later, having apparently not learned my lesson, I learned I was going to be a father again with a different woman. But this time she wanted the child aborted. I had to threaten her that I would tell her parents, who didn't know, so she would not proceed. She also was seven months on the way and would have gotten herself killed in the process. I saved my son's life and everytime I see him I know I made the right decision.

If you or anyone you know is considering abortion, please consider adoption as well. I would adopt every unwanted child if I could. Find a good home for your child instead of ending his life.

 

The option I'd go with isn't available in the poll.

I'd go with whatever my wife/gf wanted. If she wants to give birth, wonderful; I'd support her all the way (though I'd probably suffer a nervous breakdown worrying about whether or not I'd be a competent father). If she doesn't, well...I'd be disappointed (though I'd probably be a bit relieved, shamefully enough), but I wouldn't try to fight her, because I don't believe I have the right to do so.

At least, I think that's what I'd do. Having never been presented with such a situation, it's a bit hard to say for certain.

 

I would not like to have to make such a choice and things would have to be quite dire for me to ponder wanting abortion. In general I would like to say that I would never do it myself but I support the right to choose. Things arent that simple however, if I for some reason got someone I did not intend to live with pregnant and someone I found seriously unbalanced I would advocate abortion, same with if me and my spouses financial situation is extremely dire. Well, my point is that I could ponder abortion for myself if things are bad enough but not if the timing is merely uncomfortable. I would however always choose abortion over adoption though, I am possessive enough to rather "kill" my child than to let anyone else have it. May sound strange but thats me.

 

Death penalty is akin to self-defence in some circumstances, which is when there is no other way to protect the society from a really dangerous criminal than to execute him.

There is no necessary link between calling abortion homicide and not calling dropping a bomb from an airplane onto an innocent child homicide.

 

Really? What if they execute the wrong guy?