POLL: SW: Padme's Episode III Fate With Buddhist Twist

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Well folks, there hasn't been a SW poll in awhile so now I present to you the deepest one yet. A fellow Star Wars fan came up with this and it's worth the read. Tell me what you think:

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Joseph Campbell talks about one of the Bodhisattvas of Buddhism, the Lotus Bearer, Avalokiteshvara, "The Lord Looking Down in Pity." Campbell explains that "he regards with compassion all sentient creatures suffering the evils of existence. To him goes the millionfold-repeated prayer of the prayer wheels and temple gongs of Tibet: Om mani padme hum, 'The jewel is in the lotus.'" And so we come to Padme, her name literally being translated as the Lotus. What is the significance of this? Is Padme the embodiment of the Lotus Bearer, the being that looks to the world with compassion? Here Campbell explains further:

"In China and Japan this sublimely gentle Bodhisattva is represented not only in male form, but also as female, Kwan Yin of China, Kwannon of Japan--the Madonna of the Far East--is precisely this benevolent regarder of the world. She will be found in every buddhist temple of the farthest Orient. She is blessed alike to the simple and to the wise; for behind her vow there lies a profound intuition, world-redeeming, world-sustaining. The pause on the threshold of Nirvana, the resolution to forego until the end of time (which never ends) immersion in the untroubled pool of eternity, represents a realization that the distinction between eternity and time is only apparent--made, perforce, by the rational mind, but dissolved in the perfect knowledge of the mind that has transcended the pairs of opposites. What is understood is that time and eternity are two aspects of the same experience-whole, two planes of the same nondual ineffable; i.e., the jewel of eternity is in the lotus of birth and death: om mani padme hum."

Campbell goes are far as to say that compassion literally translates into com=with and passion=to suffer thereby meaning "to suffer with." Lucas in turn recognizes compassion as "unconditional love," according to the words of Anakin Skywalker. One can see certainly that Padme loves Anakin unconditionally and that in the end she will choose to suffer with him. Indeed she is world-redeeming and that her love is eternal, traversing both time and her own death in the form of her children. Her choice to suffer is in her understanding that joy is found within the suffering.

There are those that found it out of character that she would empathize with Anakin after his confession (of slaughtering the Tuskens), but really this is fully within her character in showing that her unconditional love fulfills her wish to participate in the sufferings of the world. So too is the question of her dying in sadness, but now knowing that it is not a point of weakness, but in actuality a point of strength, in being so her choice to suffer with Anakin. Unconditional love, obviously is not a condonement of all actions, but is a belief beyond actions to the humanity that lies within. In so doing, she survives beyond death through her children and passes on her gift of the lotus. In so doing, Luke in the end chooses to suffer with his father and his father in turn chooses to suffer with him. In so doing, the world is redeemed as demonstrated by the sacrifice of the Bodhisattvas represented as Padme. And so Padme will not die in Episode III nor will she cast Anakin away. She will willingly choose to suffer with him, and die within her suffering. Om mani padme hum.

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OK so here's the deal.

1st Question: On-screen or off-screen death for Padme? In other words will it happen in Episode III or be implied to happen between Episodes III and IV?

2nd Question: You pick what you think Padme's fate will be like in Episode III.

Poll Information
This poll contains 2 question(s). 20 user(s) have voted.
Voting starts at December 11, 2002 02:48 board time.
You may not view the results of this poll without voting.

Poll Results: SW: Padme's Episode III Fate With Buddhist Twist (20 votes.)

On screen or Off screen death for Padme? What do you think? (Choose 1)
* On screen death. Yousa gonna die Padme. - 65% (13)
* Off screen death. Your time is not yet Padme, you must bear sadness for some time and then die. - 35% (7)

Which statement better sums up Padme's reaction to Anakin's turn in Episode III? (Choose 1)
* Padme sees the monster Anakin has become and wants nothing to do with him. - 30% (6)
* Padme believes there is still good in Anakin and attempts to stay by his side, suffering with him. - 70% (14)

 

Nice poll ... my wife and I were discussing similar issues.

Our thoughts went in a slightly different path than your question 2 allowed. Granted, we are not the uber-fans that you are, so these are our uneducated opinions ....

We think that the Jedi will find out about the secret marriage or the pregnancy and do something that leads to Padme's death. (either sending her away to where Anikan cannot protect her, or even as extreme as executing her).

Remember Anikan's outburst when his mom died? That someday he'll even be able to stop death? He will try, fail, and fall completely into darkness.

I think the new Vader's evil is an immature "love" turned to hate. Love for Obi-Wan but not understanding the need for discipline, love for his mom that turns into slaughter, love for Padme that turns into his huntinig down and killing the remaining Jedi.

What do you think?

 

Well I know the Jedi aren't being portrayed as saints in the prequels, nor should they be. Their flaws are part of what makes them fall. But I think executing Padme is too much for the Jedi. I'm still up in the air about the stance they will take when they find out, if they haven't already started supecting it already. I mean after the duel with Dooku and Padme and the clone troopers arrive, Padme pracitically runs up to Anakin and embraces him right in front of Obi-Wan and Yoda. Is Yoda allowing them to get togeher? Is it a test? Will they expel him? Will he leave the Order on his own? Will they let it slide for now because they are deep in war and he is the Chosen One so they need to have him close so they can keep tabs on him? I don't know.

But I really like this idea of Padme choosing to suffer alongside Anakin. It's that idea that there is still good in him. And when she fails to get him to realize that, it will be tragic. It's as if she won't turn his back on him, but once he's experienced the power of the dark side, he turns his back on her. That's when Luke comes along in the next trilogy, first time viewers will be like, no way is he going to turn Vader good, not if his mother couldn't. Again, that's speculation though.

Another neat thing is Padme may die, but her legacy lives on. It lives on through her kids, her ideas (the Rebellion), and even her droid, R2, who saves the day numerous times. One of my favorite things about the end of ESB right now is when R2 fixes the hyperdrive on the Falcon and Vader doesn't get to capture Luke and Leia.

Edit: Oh yeah, and about Anakin being able to stop people from dying. That may be a major part in Episode III. But it is already a major part in ROTJ. He stops his own son from dying, but sacrifices himself. And remember in TPM when he said he would free the slaves? That's like when he defeats the Emperor, all the systems bound by the Imperials, all the slaves of the Empire, are set free.

[ December 11, 2002, 17:26: Message edited by: Big B ]

 

Good thoughts Big B.

On the execution thing .. yeah, that's out there, but I see the Jedi being very law-bound, so if death is a penalty in the code somewhere, they would have to abide by it. More likely, they would exile them or such (like you suggest).

Ever wonder why Vader never recognizes R2 or C3PO? He built 3PO ... if you've watched the middle three movies lately (I haven't) does Vader ever get close to the droids?

Also, in Episode 3, how will R2's jet-powered flight ability get broken. That would have come in handy in Return of the Jedi when escaping from Jabba!

 

George wanted a cool name. Padme meant Lotus which is ladylike, and still had a name that would fit into the universe.

Kewl He thought. I'll ditch Jackie.

 

Yeah right now there isn't much of a problem with Vader recognizing the droids. The closest contact he has with them is shooting at Artoo in Luke's X-Wing, but that's standard for those types of fighters to have artoo units. In ESB, C-3PO is in pieces strapped to Chewbacca's back in the Carbon Freezing Chamber. Whether he recongizes him then or not is irrelevant to him, that's part of a past he no longer acknowledges.

The bigger question for some people is how come Uncle Owen never recongizes C-3PO when he buys him from the Jawas. But if you pay attention, you see droids like C-3PO everywhere. They're in the background of all the movies. It would be like Owen recognizing a toaster that worked on his farm twenty years ago. Owen makes the whole buying droids from Jawa thing sound as if he does it at least twice a year. The farms run on droids, when they get old, he gets new ones. He doesn't put much thought into it. All we know is the when Luke starts mentioning Obi-Wan at the dinner table, Owen is like "take those droids to get their memory erased" and the next day they're gone, the stormtroopers attack the homestead, and the rest is history.

There's a joke right now about Artoo's rockets running out and not being on warranty, so he gets rid of them and doesn't have them in the later episodes.

Jackie. Lol. Thank goodness not. Reminds me of a past relationship that didn't go too well . I think it is cool though that not only was Padme taken from Eastern culture but also the type of make-up and look she had in TPM.

 

Maybe Padme is sent to Alderran which basically means she dies in EPISODE IV. I'm just taking a shot in the dark; offering a new theory.

 

After episode II my thoughts were that Padme's death is what will drive Anikan over the edge to the darkside. He has lost another loved one and if the Jedi were suppose to be protecting her, he would then look for something stronger then the Jedi for power and revenge.