POLL: What does America stand for - for you?

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Once again pondering about that miraculous nation overseas, I wondered what America stands for. What associations do people make in respect with America.

Having thought about it, I came to a point of view that is formed by what I do:

America stands for the rule of law and due process.

The reason why I see this so, is probably most of all the condemnation of the crimes of Nazi Germany and to a juch lesser extent, of Japan.

Of course, that was victor's justice and I'm still somewhat unpersuaded about the legitimacy of the court the victors assembled. Nevertheless, the sentences and accusations were generally right.

It was a very principled moral statement.

Poll Information
This poll contains 1 question(s). 51 user(s) have voted.
You may not view the results of this poll without voting.

Poll Results: What does America stand for - for you? (51 votes.)

What does America stand for - for you? (Choose 1)
* ... rule of law - 8% (4)
* ... freedom - 8% (4)
* ... the idea of being able to rise up from humble dishwasher to billionaire - 10% (5)
* ... a new start - 0% (0)
* ... God is on George Bush's side - 4% (2)
* ... a new Israel, redemption - 0% (0)
* ... the can-do-spirit - 16% (8)
* ... cool landscape - 0% (0)
* ... naked agression; center of all evil and of all ills of the world - 25% (13)
* ... none (please elaborate) - 29% (15)

 

How unfortunate tht the "rule of law" that America stands for is such an incredibly mutable thing, subject to the whims of whatever special interest group(s) that paid to elect the current administration.

Pardon me, but my cynicism is showing.

So Rags, what do you Germany as standing for? Can I request that posters from countries other than the US please indicate what they see their own countries standing for?

 

I voted the can-do-spirit. Rally has already covered how I feel. Rally, I'm beginning to think that we are soul-sisters.

 

I voted "none". The principles this country was founded on were undoubtedly admirable. Secularism, liberty, the right to dissent etc. But America has been on a backslide in recent years for a number of reasons.

For starters the internet makes information more readily available adn brings us all closer to each other and able to share views. This makes it much easier to dispell popular myths about certain minorites(re: atheists) and all manner of other subjects as well.
When people are brought closer together and are given a chance to get to know what others are about they are more likely to reject certain traditional, fear-based characterizations(re: gay bashing). I think this is having an adverse affect on the numbers of fundementallist religious folks(the most influential portion of the conservative voting block) and, like the Dansbury Baptists, they are in panic mode! But UNLIKE the Dansbury Baptists, tehy are not seeking a "wall of seperation of Church and State" to protect their interests. They are instead seeking to rally the masses for a sort of Alamo-like last stand against progressive ideals!

Have you noticed that they are recently attacking on all fronts? Public schools in Georgia and elsewhere trying to force Creationism into the science class. Various bills and constitutional amendments in support of the "sanctity of marriage" and "right to life". Environmental/EPA protocols being dismissed. Wars in the middle east. The bizarre and highly irrational reaction to Michael Newdow's Pledge challenge, etc.

In the end, we all know what is coming. America will be dragged, kicking and screaming into the 21st century and after we have been there for a while, we will see it is not the battleground for Armageddon and religious conservatives will then act like they never had any problem with these progressive ideals such as gay marriage and revisiting the secularism our country was founded on.
The same way that they now behave like they never opposed blacks rights to vote in the 50's and 60's and they never started a civil war over their "right to own slaves" and they never opposed the discoveries of Galileo and Copernicus.

 

Dream on RuneQuester! progressive (ie liberal) ideals are on the decline in this country. America will never be like the Euros, thank god.

 

I am not a supporter of of the current US administration and dislike immensely the direction the US seems to be going in the world but it kind of annoys when you hear others that are not citizens of the US criticize it. Not saying they can not have their opinions on the US but it is kind of like you can make fun and criticize yourself all you want but when someone else does it, it hurts/annoys.


I am new to posting but have been lurking quite a while before registering. I do not mean to offend anyone by my post, it is just an opinion.

 

Oddbean (cool nick, BTW), I completely share your opinion. That's exactly why I asked for non-US posters to include their opinions about their own countries, as well. Just trying to pull the discussion farther back from the brink of bashing.

 

I think this could be an excellent thread. The addition of what people think of their own country might be interesting, but may detract from the raw emotion of the post.

Let people bash away. I think there are a lot of Americans that really have no clue what the world thinks of them, and would be quite surprised at the range of emotions.

I still recommend ALL Americans read 'The Ugly American' before travelling abroad.

 

I chose the dishwasher to billionaire option. There were many that I felt strongly about, but that one best matched my views about everything that is right and wrong about America.

 

Personally, I don't really care for applying broad labels but I guess I would describe the U.S.A. as being proud and loud.

Americans as a group tend to be very proud of their country and way of life - and are quite vocal about it. The U.S. government's dealings with other countries tends to reflect this. I'm not saying that Americans don't have a lot of things to be proud of, but people from other countries tend to get rubbed the wrong way by it.

To contast that, I would say that Canadians, on the whole, tend to be every bit as proud but we are pretty quiet about it. We are proud of our country and our way of life but we typically don't go around boasting about it and thus implying that others' ways of life are somehow wrong or inferior. As a result non-Canadians seem to think that we are nice and polite people.

As far as most of the options on the poll go - some would apply but no more so than most developed countries.

Rallymama's comments about the laws pretty much matches my opinion about them, not that we are any better in that regard.

As far as freedom goes, I would have to say that the two party system of selecting which of two equally unsatisfactory groups of dictators will run things isn't any more impressive than what other countries have in place. As far as personal freedoms are concerned, given how paranoid the U.S. government has gotten post 9/11 and given the rampant religeous conservatism of certain areas I would say that the U.S.A. probably ranks fairly low on that scale actually.

The American dream is just that - a dream. For the most part the rich stay rich and the poor stay poor. Any amount of shifting between status groups is pretty much the same as most other countries.

 

@Khazadman

Right...we will sink into a Taliban styled theocracy before we let that happen . The odd thing is that it was America that inspired the prgressiveness of the "Euros" and it is now the "Euros" laughing at our little backwater country.

The only alternatives to progress are regress or stasis. Since we are never likely to be satisfied with the state of things(we will always strive for "better"), stasis is unlikely. That leaves regress. Let's look at what lies in wait for us in the direction of regress shall we?

* Slavery and general denial of the humanity of those who are unlike us in superficial ways(re: skin color).

* Superstition and voodoo as a medical treatment and general abhorence of scientific progress.

* Witch hunts/Crusades/Inquisitions

* Gang-rule over cities.

* Bowing to the Tyranny of a monarch or Pope/Divine Emperor

* Banning writings which contain "dangerous ideas".

* Wire hanger abortions

* Listening to nothing but Gospel and swing music


Did I leave anything out?


Edit: Also, trash the "Euros" all you want but they have most the good emerging scientists, get along with each other pretty well, are not hated by the rest of the world, don't have our ridiculous crime rate and do not have 2% of their population in prison because of antiquated drug laws.

 

Wow, RQ, you're list is so far over the edge of reason. What makes you think we'll head down any of those? I don't see a future like that.

By the way, you may want to rethink the 'most of the good emerging scientists' comment. I see very competent scientists throughout the world -- most of them have credentials from US universities. I certainly don't see any advantage based on geography in the scientific community. The US has its share of Nobel Prize winners.

 

I went with the "rags to riches" scenario too...it seems most to embody personal accountability, opportunity and freedom.

@RQ

You seem to continue to be very confused about American History...last time I checked MLK was a Methodist pastor...still. And didn't the abolitionist movement find it's roots in Northern religious fundamentalists?

Faith and persons thereof have played a tremendously vital role in the development of our nation...and they always will. It's a pity that the only choice that embodied that in any way utilized the ignorant and worn out "God talks to 'W' " motif.

 

My current dominant view of America is "living beyond your means" or "live for today, worry about the future later".

 

I don't particularly care for this country. I am moving to New Zealand as soon as I am able. My major problem with this country is the ultra-conservative party. They are the most vocal members of the Republican party, or maybe I just hear more from them because they can't shut the hell up. Anyway, I do not believe this country is honoring what it has stood for since its creation. We are moving if not backwards, then sideways and to the rear.

 

@ Ravynn

New Zealand has some problems of its own, although we are arguably more concerned over the performance of our national sports teams than politics!

*Shudder!*

 

I could not agree more. But don't give up, Ravynn! Keep the faith just a little longer.

And consider this:

"If Jefferson was wrong, America is wrong. If America is right, Jefferson was right" - James Parton

 

I think America stands for having the freedom to rule your own personal kingdom.

Don't like your church...?

Create your own.

Don't like your job...?

Create your own business.

Don't like your spouse...?

Get a new one.

Don't like your politian...?

Get a new one or become one yourself.

Do you like people...?

Live in a city...you are allowed to move there.

Do you not like people...?

Move into the woods; they still exist here...at least for the time being.

 

Don't like your house? . . . get a bigger mortgage.

Don't like your car? . . . take out a loan and get a newer one.

Don't like your cash? . . get a credit card.