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Should a ticket always be a ticket?

Discussion in 'Alley of Dangerous Angles' started by Beren, Aug 12, 2011.

  1. Beren

    Beren Lovesick and Lonely Wanderer Staff Member Member of the Week Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    http://www.torontosun.com/2011/05/19/alberta-fire-aid-group-hit-with-315-ticket

    I was friends with the driver during high school (he's half Aboriginal, half Italian).

    There's apparently more than one side to this issue, if you look at some of the comments below.

    Given what the driver was there for, and his difficulties finding parking space, should the officer have exercised discretion? How about the larger issue? Should the law always be enforced to the letter, irrespective of circumstance? Should officers exercise discretion instead? If they can, when? Where does the line get drawn?

    On the other hand, there's a real point behind enforcing the 'no parking in a disabled spot' bylaw? Can you imagine someone with a disability pulling up and then having to park at the far end of the lot cause the rules weren't complied with?
     
  2. 8people

    8people 8 is just another way of looking at infinite ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    [​IMG] Is an odd one. I'd say it shouldn't be a valid ticket if the driver was willing and attempting to move the vehicle.

    I'm guessing parking attendants have the same ridiculous budgets over there as they do in the UK where if they don't pass out a specified number of tickets they risk losing their jobs or wages.

    Parking attendants in the UK will generally direct a person to a disabled or parent only parking if it is the only available place and will often discuss it with the driver if it's a case of "if you're popping in for a minute that's okay but I can't leave you without a ticket if you take more than ten."

    Hell when moving house a parking attendant let us get away with not paying at all for three hours because we had a problem with the contract and we warned him it would take a long time but he was insistant "Five minutes won't matter"

    Saying that you get the power mad ones who will ticket you 'for the lols' pretty much. My mother has recieved three parking tickets when displaying my disabled badge, two of those instances because they saw me get out the car then into a wheelchair - but I stood up between being in the car and the chair. Another because in the UK disabled badge holders can park on single yellows as long as they don't obscure traffic, on the ticket the officer had written "Can't prove driver is disabled as wasn't here when they parked." :rolleyes:

    My grandad used to be a parking attendant until someone thought it would be funy to hit him with the car and drive off. (Including stopping and getting out the car after hitting him, pointing and laughing, then driving off.) so I also think the responses are a bit overboard.

    Overall I've seen enough hassle with ableds nabbing disabled spaces with NO cause that the strictness is in part justified. However there is discretion required on purpose and availability of alternative spaces. (Parking in a disabled space because you've got an unecessarily massive car isn't a proper reason btw!)
     
  3. Shoshino

    Shoshino Irritant Veteran

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    I hate people who think that by turning on their hazard lights they can stop where they want, no stopping/no parking means exactly that, hazard lights are for emergencies only.

    if that were the case the legitimacy of no parking zones would be all but gone, as people would treat them as no parking, unless a parking officer is nearby and he's only going to tell you to move. Likewise an officer doesnt have to warn anyone about anything, by holding a licence you have agreed to follow the laws which govern the roads, you know the law, you follow the law or face the consequences.

    As for the delivery, every delivery driver knows that if you are making a delivery and unable to find a parking space you ring the local authority who can give you permission. If you have a legimate claim against a ticket you can chellenge it, appeal now.com released 2 entertaining adverts:









    it you have a claim the ticket can always be overturned, but in most cases the ticket is legitimate.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 19, 2015
  4. Gaear

    Gaear ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful

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    Personally I get suspicious whenever I hear the "for the children" refrain. What it really means is "I'm guilty but you should let me go because I'm nice." It's not like parking laws don't or shouldn't apply to people doing charity work, no matter the shameless attempt to bring that into the equation. It also makes me suspicious about whether or not the driver really dutifully tried to find a space (no doubt feverish in his zeal to get his cargo to the children) or if he maybe didn't try so hard, feeling maybe that he shouldn't have to obey the laws so much because he's such a good guy. Likewise the "pouncing" nature of the parking cop's actions. More likely he was just sitting there eating a sandwich and thinking "Oh come on, I can't believe this guy's actually going to do this." ;)

    One thing though - if the guy was making a charity delivery after having donated blood, that changes everything, because it means he's a really nice guy, and really nice guys shouldn't have to worry about parking violations, period. :shake:
     
  5. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I think officers should absolutely (and do) have discretion on when to give out tickets. I think parking tickets are the least likely mostly because the driver is most often not there and parking enforcement officers are mainly a-holes :)

    Another factor is communities begin to rely on the revenue stream from fines so if there is a drop in number their budgets suffer.

    I can certainly sympathize though. Not too long ago I went by my parent's place to help them out. This is my childhood home where I lived more than a third of my life, and there had never been any kind of parking restrictions on the residential streets when I lived there. Turns out there is now a three hour window on Fridays for street sweeping. There are signs (though not in front of my parent's place), but I wasn't looking for them since as I said I used to live there and there wasn't any restriction.

    Needless to say I was surprised by a ticket on my windshield when I left. The officer could have just rang the bell and asked me to move it; we were all there the entire time. But no, that would be too much trouble and deprive the city of the nice fine.
     
  6. Blades of Vanatar

    Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Is it their job to knock on your door? Hell no. That would only put them in confrontation with most yahoos out there. That would be a stupid policy on their part. Driving is a privilege, not a right. You took the test and read the books when you got your license. When driving you must be aware of your surroundings. If you choose to ignore them, you will get the fine for breaking the law. That is what happened to you. You call thees guys an a-holes? He was doing his job by enforcing the rules.

    Now, with that said, I would fight the ticket if I were you. The change in rules can be decieving. An explanation to the judge could get you out of the ticket, espeially since you grew up there and now all of the sudden they are changing the parking rules. My old man has fought every ticket he has ever rec'd. A few were rather rdiculous. He has beat all but one of them. He knowingly parked in a no parking zone for 4 hours while making a delivery of a Shuffleboard to a bar in Philly. Because it was the closest access to the bar. Dumb move on his part.
     
  7. LKD Gems: 31/31
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    Follow the law or pay the penalty. We all skirt laws like this from time to time, and 99% of the time we get away with it. That 1% of the time you should take your medicine. Or go to court and fight it -- such is your right, but don't expect the law to bend just because you are a "nice guy", as someone said
     
  8. Shoshino

    Shoshino Irritant Veteran

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    In the UK the curb is marked at regular intervals to show that parking restrictions are enforced, if you see lines on the curb then look for a sign to find out the restrictions.
     
  9. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I have no compassion for someone parking in a handicapped spot, I really don't care the reason. That the charity actually deals with handicapped people and the driver would still park in a handicapped spot makes the driver even more deserving of the ticket.
     
  10. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Oh, I don't know if this particular guy (or girl) was an a-hole or not; I'm talking about anecdotal evidence of a-holeness of parking enforcement in general (including several TV shows about them recently). :)

    And I don't really care about the ticket and didn't fight it because obviously I was in the wrong, and it would have been more of a hassle to fight it than pay it anyway. What I'm talking about is common decency that is absent. The reason for the parking restriction is ostensibly for street sweeping, not as a money maker for the city; wouldn't it have been better to have me move my car to not impede the street sweeper rather than just fine me? I don't get fined, the street sweeper can sweep the street; everyone's happy. Except of course the city who lost out on their money-making scheme. :)
     
  11. joacqin

    joacqin Confused Jerk Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Or the poor park attendant who you apparently expect to run around looking for owners to wrongly parked cars and then getting them to move them?!
     
  12. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Please. The poor parking officer who couldn't walk a few steps to the front door and inquire if the parked car belonged to someone inside. I'm not talking about a shopping center or an apartment complex. I was parked in front of my folks' house. It would have taken the person a few seconds; probably less than it took to write up the ticket. The poor, poor parking officer :rolleyes:

    And I didn't say I expected it; I said it would be the decent thing to do.
     
  13. Mesmero

    Mesmero How'd an old elf get the blues?

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    Mercy is a shield used by the weak. Mercy is weakness. Mercy is death. No one is innocent.

    Oh wait, that's ********.

    Funny you should mention that story BTA, they recently started enforcing the parking restrictions at my parents' place as well. Parking on the street has always been illegal there, but it had never been enforced in the 8 years that they lived there. It's basically a very wide, dead end road and the only people passing it are people who live in that street and the occasional lost driver. But the council recently decided that they are strictly going to enforce the rule and my parents' neighbors actually got tickets for parking on the street, in front of their own driveway. I'm pretty sure they are going to fight it, since the city hasn't provided enough parking spaces and there is just no other place to park than the street, if people are for example visiting. Now I don't blame the police officer if his superior tells him to go to that street and ticket every car parked on the street; it isn't his job to say no, just like it isn't mine to tell no to my boss. But if one passes the neighborhood, just patrolling or getting back from a call or something, I hope he has the decency not to ticket a car on the street that simply has no other place to park.

    And one of the benefits of having a motorcycle: no wind screen wipers to put a ticket underneath :p
     
  14. Shoshino

    Shoshino Irritant Veteran

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    these houses have driveways? is the pavement(sidewalk) dipped at these driveways? It is an offense to obstruct a dipped pavement. Lets say the council relaxes the parking restrictions on this road and joe bloggs parks his car blocking someone's driveway, Im sure the residents would have enough to say.

    if a parking officer did that it would be twisted into "Parking officers hassling mortorists by knocking their doors"
     
  15. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Heh. I can't imagine anyone saying the officer is hassling them for helping them avoid a ticket...
     
  16. Marceror

    Marceror Chaos Shall Be Sown In Their Footsteps Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Occasionally, just every once in a while, I wouldn't mind if a ticket was actually a check for $1,000,000. Wouldn't that be twist!

    My day is completely ruined.... Wait a second!
     
  17. Mesmero

    Mesmero How'd an old elf get the blues?

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    There is no pavement. It's just driveway flowing into road. But it would be illegal anyway to block a driveway, any driveway, regardless of the no parking signs or dipped pavements or anything. It isn't a huge driveway leading up to the house, it's just a place in front that fits two cars. But normally, the police wouldn't look twice at a car blocking a driveway in the middle of suburbia. They would just assume that the car was from the person living there or was visiting there, and think there was no harm in it, because nobody blocks somebody else's driveway (at least not around here).
     
  18. Shoshino

    Shoshino Irritant Veteran

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    hmm, so this is a place where people parked blocking driveways, parking restrictions are in place but not enforced and suddenly the council starts rigorously enforcing the restrictions... someone complained.
     
  19. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    There are a lot of people who see things in strict black and white. I'm generally unimpressed with that type of thinking. They are the first ones to come into a store past the return period and want a refund or exchange. When you make a purchase you agree to the terms, and 30 days means 30 days. The same thing for no recipt and exchanges and returns. Most everyone ignores what they agree to at the time of purchase. Do we make exceptions? You bet. "So it's ony 32 days? Ok fine. Let me give you a refund." Because we try to give people a break. The world is not so black and white as some people believe.

    And cops are the worst because they feel they should get a break or special discount when they shop. Everyone thinks rules should be "exactly by the letter" until they have an excuse. Then it should be different.
     
  20. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    Of course they could apply discretion. It depends entirely on the situation. If they see you park in a handicapped spot, get out of your car, and walk normally into the store, well, you're going to get a ticket. But most situations aren't so black and white.
     
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