Tactics/Ascension party

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Hello, I recently installed tactics, ascension etc to get some challenge in a game I've already played through several times.

After reading alot of comments here about the difficulty of those mods, I figured I'd want a party who can pack quite a punch.
The plan so far is this:

Barbarian: This is the tank. Lots and lots of hp, immunity to backstab and rage speaks for itself. I also plan to get as much damage resistance as possible by dual wielding the flail from the bonus merchants etc.

Berzerker/Cleric: A human berzerker dualled to cleric at lvl 9. Why berzerker and why lvl 9 I have no idea :/, just seemed like a good idea.

Sorcerer: The ultimate arcane caster imo.

Those are the ones I'd definately need. The classes I'm considering are:

Some kind of fighter thief. This could be a kensai/thief, assassin fighter, multiclass fighter/thief, whatever. I'm open to suggestions. This would be an excellent second tank with the UAI ability, and could wreck much havoc with staff of the ram backstab goodness.

Second sorcerer. Can't get too many sorcerers

Wizard slayer. Equipped with the fastest weapons available, to pile as much miscast magic on the mages in the shortest time. Would for obvious reasons be the tank against casters.

Pure kensai or archer. This is meant to be a support char who never really get hit, so AC doesn't matter. The reason I'm considering those two versus eachother, is because I'm using the item upgrade mod aswell, and I can imagine a kensai with the upgraded impaler could do unholy amounts of damage bordering on cheese. Another option could be two 1-handed throwing weapons.

While we are at classes I have to say that while I enjoy having a powerfull party, I also enjoy the story and npc banter. The npc class/kit change mods can alter some of the npcs to classes I like, but not all, so I was wondering about using SK, but I've heard something about bugs caused by playing around with npcs...?

The list of mods im going to install:

Tortured Souls
Oversight
Ascension
Redemption
Tactics
Unfinished Business
Freedoms Reign and Reign of Virtue
Ease of use
Item Upgrade

These should be compatible with eachother, as long as they are installed in the correct order (i think...).

As said I'm open to any suggestions and advice

 

sounds fun... maybe a bit too many mods, but it might work together. I definitely recommend Ascension and Tactics.

 

First: I did not think that BG2 allowed players to use two throwing weapons at once, even if they are both one handed.
Second: Kensai's can't use throwing weapons, including throwing axes and daggers and the like.

I'd use a paladin of some kind. Right now I'm playing a game that sports two paladins (an inquis and a cavalier). The inquis using 2handed swords (eventually Holy Avenger) and the cavalier using a bastard sword and a shield. I would at least take one paladin. I seem to enjoy the sword and shield style paladin more, but either way is good.

I don't know what tactics and ascention are like, but here's my suggestion anyways (I like fighter heavy, mage light parties)

Barbarian
Berserker // Cleric or Ranger // Cleric
Sorcerer
Paladin (Inquis or Cavalier)
Blade
Swashbuckler

This party gives us rather strong magic (a high level bard casting low level spells still does a lot of damage [esp with spells like melfs acid arrow and skull trap]) and the sorcerer. It gives us 2 good tanks (barbarian and Paladin) along with three mediocre fighters (fighter//cleric, blade, swashbuckler), good thieving skills, and mediocre clerical abilities. It lacks backstabbing abilities, but if you are keen on backstabbing you could always swap the swash for an assassin or a fighter/theif.
At later levels this party sports excellent trap abilities, great bardic song, and a very low AC swashbuckler. Take UAI with your bard and you can use the Purifier, while the Holy Avenger is wreaking havoc with your real paladin.

 

I actually don't know if you can use 2 throwing weapons, since I've never really played around with ranged classes. In normal BG2 with ToB installed I never found ranged weapons nessesary; I'd just zerg the enemy with my all my melee fighters

As for the throwing kensais, I think I read somewhere that they can use any throwing weapon, as long as they could be used in melee. Was probably a missunderstanding on my part. It would make sense if they could use the weapons melee ability but not throw it. I'll have to check up on that.
Anyway I'll prolly go with the archer, as the upgraded impaler is almost to cheesy. While I might be a bit of a powergamer, I also like a challenging and fun game

A paladin is definately worth considering for Carsomyr alone. I forgot a thief won't get UAI before very late in SoA with a 6 man party, since I just played solo. Maybe he should replace the wizard slayer? I want a thief, and I have a feeling multiple spellcasters are essensial in tactics and ascension.

Damn I hate choices.

Thanks for the input guys

 

If you want a paladin, I'd go for the undead hunter since he's immune to level drain - makes vampire encounters much less anoying.

Berserker/Cleric
Fighter/Thief (dual) or Swashbuckler
Sorcerer
Barbarian

The wizard slayer isn't worth much in my opinion, and since you're already melee heavy, I would take a cleric/mage as the final character.

 

Inquisitor - Carsomyr wilder and dispeller

Barbarian - Main purpose: Damage Absorber, this guy gets lots of hp and nice resists, give him low ac and high res items . He'll never die

Fighter/Mage (MC/DC) Backup mage and secondary tank, many wicked spell combos

Ranger/Cleric (MC/DC) Druid and cleric power also secondary tank. This is a very powerfull character.

Kensai/Thief (DC) When you get UAI this guy really starts to shine. I would recommend 13 Kensai lvl's before dual, but that's really a personal preference.

Sorceror Don't leave home without one!

This is the party I would pick if I were looking for an ultimate party.

As for the ranger/cleric and fighter/mage I would probably keep them both multi-class, but if you want to dual them that's fine too.

 

Barbarian or Paladin (any kit you wish, but I like Inquisitors)
Kensai[13]/Thief (for stalking and wearing armour when you get UAI)
Beserker[13]/Druid (more offensive than a Cleric but will take ages to get the better spells)
Ranger/Cleric (MC) (well you do need healing right)
Thief[9]/Mage (for locks and traps and greater spell variability)
Sorcerer (for toasted vampire)

Take 13 levels only if you are getting the unnerfed GM and THAC0 tables. Else 9.
The duals are gonna be a pain but I guess you can take it by now. All the better to get the higher level abilities faster.
MCing the Fighter/Thief may be an option but not with the other two.

 

My main reason for considering wizard slayer was the miscast magic and magicresist, but after reading Berens and Six of Spades' tactics reviews, I've decided against it.
I got the impression contengencies with lower magic resist and uninterruptable (and spell failure piercing) spells are quite common, thus rendering the wizard slayer a bit useless.

The fighter/mage would be a good addition to any party, but I'm not very keen on making one atm, since my solo run wasn't completed due to the power of said class. It got to easy, but tactics will probably make life hard, even with the timestop/5 attacks per round combo.
Also I'd like very much to be able to squeeze in an archer somewhere.

Advanced Simplicitys party is very close to the one I'd like to end up with . I'll prolly use your idea with the ranger/cleric instead of berserker/cleric; looks like a very well rounded and powerfull party indeed.

Keep it coming guys, this is helping me alot. Sometimes I hate myself for being a gaming perfectionist, I simply MUST have any angle covered before I can start the game

If any of you have experience or advice concerning SK'ing npcs and Mod compatibility that would be very welcome too. I know the order of mod installation, but I'm not entirely sure all the ones I'd like to use work with eachother.

 

Well I think that I am going to do pretty much the same thing you are. Just installed tactics and downloading Ascension now.

My Party:

Blade (long swords & long bow)
Inquisitor (two handed swords & crossbow)
Cavalier (bastard sword / axes & shield)
----
Ranger / Cleric (flails, warhammers & slings)
Fighter / Mage (katanas)
Fighter / Thief (short swords / daggers & shortbows)

the bottom three I'm not sure whether to DC or MC.
Ranger / Cleric: I'm leaning towards a dual class, because I think I'm going to need very strong clerical abilities
Fighter / Mage: Depends on whether I need more magic or whether a party of solid fighters can do tactics & ascension.
Fighter / Thief: I'd like to be able to backstab, so a swashbuckler is most likely out. I really don't know about MC or DC for this one though.
If I DC, I could either go
Kensai (9) // Thief
Wizard Slayer//Thief <-- would be interesting if he dual wields shortswords/daggers he could get a good amount of miscast magic out.
Archer (fighter kit with Tactics) // Thief <-- mostly ranged, only melee for backstabbing. Hide, backstabb, retreat some, fire arrows.

Any suggestions?

 

great choice, ascension is a good mod. if you are going to do ascension, you should definately do redemption as well, as it tied up some loose ends for me.. i'm one of those people who doesn't like unfinished stories, see?

 

My suggestion to you Geoff, since your party is already melee heavy, would be switching one of your paladins with either a sorcerer, or alternatively someone with rage like a berserker or barbarian.

The sorcerer because from what I read about tactics, it seems like dropping lots of damage very fast, or buffing/debuffing on the fly is gonna come in handy.
The barbarian or berserker because rage can be very handy in certain situations, and having a char who's immune to backstab can't be a bad thing.

As for the wizard slayer you can see my considerations about them and why I wouldn't go with one in one of my previous posts

 

I just had an idea, not sure if it will work, but,

You know how, if a bard casts mislead, the image can sing, right?
Did you also know that if a thief/mage casts mislead the image can detect traps?
(I'm sure about that bit, I just tested it out. I suppose it could be a peculiarity of my game but I can't see why it should be)

So what I'm wondering is,
If a thief/ mage casts mislead and has lots of points in detect illusions ,
when the image finds traps, will the image dispel all those (Improved)Invisibility/SI Div/ SI Abj combos that are all over the place in tactics?

If it does work I'd take

1 Dwarven Barbarian or MC fighter/Mage.
2 MC Ranger Cleric
3 MC fighter thief, 2HW, quarterstaff, two handed swords, (and since you have item upgrade) spears
4 Thief(10)/Mage: with at least 100 points in DI and lock picks
5 Sorcerer
6 Blade or Priest of Helm, ( to give you a decent chance of actually dispelling stuff.)

 

interesting idea. Will have to check that one out

I've revised my party:
ditched the blade

Inquisitor
MC ranger cleric
mc fighter illusionist
swashbuckler <-- forget backstab.. :/ I want power!
sorcerer

 

I havn't played tactics or ascention but from what I've heared over the years I would have though that a thief with backstabing would be very, very usefull. With HLA you could sneak in, set a time trap, use the HLA which makes all of you attacks do back stab damage (which wou;d be *7) and have the enemy dead, or very close to it before he can do a thing. However backstabbing can be fairly tedious and you will want a lot of invis. rings).
Also swashbucklers are not that great - Jaheira was a significantly better fighter than my swashbuckler (more hp, better thac0, more kills, lower AC etc) and I feel that a fighter/thief would be a better option.

[Edit]
How about Cernd with the shapshifter rebalecing mod?

[ October 09, 2004, 08:37: Message edited by: Stu ]

 

Cernd shapeshifter rebalancing mod? Sounds very interesting, especially because I was thinking of taking Cernd if not for the fact that he would not be able to fight very well in ToB.

I think maybe you are right, the party I have going right now is already melee-heavy enough, a fighter/thief that can backstab would be better than a swashbuckler.

Is there a NPC mod for a multiclassed fighter/mage?

I wish BG2 had more NPCs, because with the introduction of kits, there are so many uncovered areas.

 

There's the Solaufein mod. But he is lolling about in the Underdark, so you cant have him join right at the beginning. Still worth it, I say.

 

The one thing noone has answered is how to change an NPC's class. In SOA i once got the urge to change Nalia to a Level 11/12 dualled cleric/mage. So what i did was-

lower experience to just below level 2, switch back to true class cleric, remove mage spells and thief abilities, change the appearance etc. THEN you can go into the game and level them up with clua commands. Cleric spells get added automatically as your level increases, so no worries there. Do not just set things how you want them in shadowkeeper and expect it to work; you have to level up 'naturally' to make the game accept the process. Weapon proficiencies are a problem but nothing you cant bodge.

 

Well, changing the levels and classes of NPC's is sort of cheating. esp because switching nalia to a level 11/12 cleric is beyond the level of what you would get her at. And even if the rest of your party does have that much xp, and you're doing it as though nalia was in your party the whole time, you just skipped over the whole downside of dualclassing, losing your first classes abilitys for so long.

Solufein would be evil, correct? I think I'm going to have to try him out. Is it him or Valen that is supposedly really powerful?

edit: well, guess he's not evil. I just checked out the mod and it looks pretty good. Also, what's the underrepresented items mod like? Does it totally overbalance some categories of weapons? or is it pretty fair?

[ October 10, 2004, 14:39: Message edited by: Geoff ]