The Poll. What happened to Combat?

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Once I completed my first BG game I was thrilled. This was by far the best roleplaying game I had ever played. What had really impressed me was the graphics. For the first time I actually could feel present in the adventure and watch in real time what my imagination had to do in PnP. It was unique in micromanagement, next to ordinary Eye of the beholder style. This made the game excellent for combat. And it had to put less strenght in the story to make it a success. Unlike many games before who had to put all strenght in a good story (daggerfall, bards tale, krynn games, final fantasy, Eye of the beholder, you mention more.) Baldur's gate had a brand new graphics engine to run on. The game was a huge success. Perhaps the biggest in computer roleplaying.

I would never have bothered to play this game if I should have watched the game as in "Eye of beholder" style or in any of the games viewing style that came prior to BG. This game set new limits in CRPG-graphics and combat.

The game is great because it is never tiresome to walk around in this graphics doing a huge amount of side quest. The plot itself in BG-series especially BG2 is very short. It is covered up by great romances, quests, partyinteraction, sounds and graphics to make it fantastic.

My question is then. How On earth could it happen that the poll only gives graphics and combat a mere 9% and makes the plot the winner???

If the plot is so great, someone should rewrite the book(s), because it would be a definite block buster! And people should begin playing pen and paper roleplaying. There are zounds of greater plots in those campaigns out there than the actual plot (not quests) in BG-series.

I am a question mark. Please unravel it.

[This message has been edited by ArchAngel (edited December 25, 2001).]

 

Hypocrites, all of them.
That's my answer.
And I didn't vote.

 

Sure the combat where GREAT and maybe people wouldnt have liked it as much if it had been bad. But I voted for the plot. For in a RPG game it doesnt matter how good the graphics are or how cool the combat are, if the plot is aweful, you wont play it. It is as simple as that. Without the plot no game, sure there are a thousand plots that are better but the lost son of a god is enough for me atleast.

 

The poll was not about what is most important in a CRPG but what was best in BG-series! Sure the plot of the lost son was enough for me too, but was it the best part of the game?

 

First of all the graphics in these games are not that good. I haven't played BG2, but with the resolutions added in Heart of Winter I think I have a pretty good idea on what it looks like. Anybody can make a nice background, but especially when it comes to animations I believe I have seen a lot better stuff in other games.

I do like reading fantasy very much, and that is because of entertaining and thrilling story I am experiencing when picturing the whole story in my head while reading. When I play a fantasy game, I do it like reading the book, only I don't have to imagine the setting and characters. Therefor I like games where the story is entertaining, and I don't care nothing about how good the graphics or sound is as long as they're not annoying.

Graphics and sound are only a bonus to a game which is fun to play and where I can enjoy the storyline like I can enjoy a book. I voted plot.

 

The best combat system that I've ever seen in CRPGs, was in Betrayal at Krondor. It was simple, but you have a lot of opportunities to defeat the enimies, the battles were interesting. The combat and graphics were good in BG ( and even better in BGII) but not that very good.
The plot is more important item in CRPGs, that the graphics,and that's why I like Planescape torment much better than BG I-II.

 

I rarely vote on any polls. However, I share your thoughts. It was the combat that really did it for me (until those level 20+ fights in the end of ToB, those became a bit silly). Anyway, I don't think the plot deserves that much votes either, you're an orphan, raised by a powerful wizard who gets killed by an armoured stranger when defending you, and later on you learn you're the son of a god and that armoured guy is actually your brother... Give me a break. Not really much better than the old 'you're the good guys, there's an evil fiend around killing people, go stop him and save the world'.

(Betrayal at Krondor still is the best game I've played, by the way.)

 

Betrayal at Krondor was a great game! The combat system was wonderful.

Hmm, I don't know, the graphics in both games were nice but hardly anything special. Who here actually plays a CRPG for the graphics? Gimme a break.

The combat system was excelent. I love the pausing interface, it lets you meticously plan battles like in a turned based game, but allows you to watch it in real time with all of the glory.

I, however, voted for plot. The reasons are obvoius, I need not explain them. However, the thing I liked most in the game was devoloping my own character, getting powerful magical items, gaining powers, ect. When you feel proud of your character, you know its a good role playing game.

[This message has been edited by Lord Sarevok (edited December 28, 2001).]

 

Plot-Unraveling:
Plot is the stomach of an RPG. It is the fat that coats the body parts, concealing them to lessen the fall damage, if you know what I mean.
You can overstuff a stomach, you can understuff it. Either way it'll die. Arms are combat, eyes are graphics, legs are programming, and ears are the opinions of the public...metaphors all around. They'll all die off if you don't work them right.

The BG series was a vast, overweight man with small arms, one eye, and huge ears, all situated on very fat legs.

Think on that.

 

I was not looking for opinions but reasons. I am aware of the poll results.

Sarevok, You loved character development? I did too. It was the part I loved the most about the game. It has nothing to do with combat nore graphics. Though Those are the very elements in which we watch character development, so in a obvious way they are connected.

The plot has little to do with character development other than special abilities gained.

 

ArchAngle, maybe it's the time the poll is placed. You are right, when the game was released, the graphics where great, a RPG with good graphics and gameplay. It was 1998. Now we are more then 3 years further. With modern technology, Graphics became better and better (take Black & White for example or Unreal Tournament for example)
Nowadays, the graphics of BG aren't great anymore, and the graphics of BG2 are also "Not Bad"

I get your point and I agree that the gameplay, npc-interaction, the variety you have in this game, is very great, however it's a pity that the "wandering in the wilderness" is not possible in BG2.

However the plot has many sitequests and isn't large on it's own, I also did choose for the plot for this reason:

I had to choose between plot and graphics and I tried to imagine the game without the component to vote for. I came at the conclusion that I rather play a game with a good plot but with bad graphics then a game with good graphics/gameplay and a bad plat. For the plot might be small, but is does give you a goal in the game. Without a plot, you can walk around but without a goal, wich would make playing the game useless. A real good game is a game where you are really happy and reliefed when you completed the main plot

I was really happy when I killed Sarevok and Irenicus and celebrated it with some beer. I never played a game where I myself was so involved with the plot.. and that maked the game fantastic...


9% is indeed a bit low... I think Graphics was just read by many as the game-graphics.. wich are now not great... anymore.

 

To me, a CRPG which has plot and gameplay is a good game. The Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale has both, the Diablo series has both and the Might and Magic series have both. The graphics in M&M 6, Diablo 1, Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale (without HoW) is not very good in any way. Still I play them like crazy.

The combat in BG and IWD is hardly combat at all, for it is just a massive repeat of hitting the space button if I want to survive the tough battles.

Infinity games have nothing except from plot and overall gameplay (and I can't remember that overall gameplay was an option).

 

Thank you for those explanations guys . I guess the difference was that I tried to evaluate all my feelings of the game throughout the previous 3 years, not only what I feel about the game today.