What do you wish the RPGs to be like in the FUTURE?

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— I remind you the text I put in the last topic, which will be the start of this one :

— Then, it up to you !

[ November 12, 2006, 01:07: Message edited by: Taluntain ]

 

It was the start of a speech by Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr., a civil rights activist in the 1950's - 1960s. Rev. King was *never* a president of a continent or country.

On to what I think your topic is about:

Playing DnD or any RPG with live people negates the need for a computer. What would be the point? My brain is still smart enough to handle the mathematics of the game and I can remember how to do simple equations with a pencil/pen and paper. Seeing as I have a computer with me at all times (re: brain), I don't find the need for a plasic and polymer contraption necessary. My imagination does wonders a plasma screen cannot.

I'll think on this more later as I need some .

 

• Sorry for the "Martin Luther King" stuff, I am not very strong in history, and I confused the phrase with the expression " american dream " !

• But for the main subject, I really don't agree :

Kuemper, it's unfair to you, you try only to strengthen ONE of the TWO main opinions showed in the source topic :
<< Pen & paper or PC? Which one packs more fun? >>

BUT, it's no more the topic HERE.

[ As yours, my imagination is powerful enough to build, in my mind, a marvellous landscape, but it is ALSO cool to watch it, for example on a LCD wall ! ]

THE actual topic IS to tell us WHAT YOU wish for the future, (if you don't love very much my first proposition above).

 

I love the idea, really, but what I love about Computer RPGs is different. I love playing computer RPGs alone, as it feels special and unique, a story, a saga, an epic adventure all special to me, and it is loads of fun! I can not play BG2 comfortably if a friend watches me, really.

On the other hand, table top games, now that is totally a different universe. You are not alone anymore. Here, you gather with your friends and have fun, and you are only limited by your creativity, not the scripts of the game, or resolotion of your monitor or whatever!

See, I love both of the two concepts, and enjoy playing them whenever I can. I have no wish to really combine the aspects of the two, as of yet. (and I do not think it is possible in the near future!)

But it is fun to think about posibilities! Technology is marvelous and improving! Maybe we can feel the real 'warmth' of the breath of an angry red dragon in our games in the future! Wouldn't that be great ?

 

Yes, combination of the TWO aspects :

• Friends, + flexibility of actions/dialogues

AND

• Computer, with swift calculation power, + visualisation of landscapes

... is an idea both innovating and somewhat perturbing,
but ... a lot of NEW things are alike !

And, after all :
WHY NOT ?

 

Well tyvm for clearing it up. I have a heck of a time figuring out wtf you're trying to say.

Keep your computer out of my tabletop games and I'll keep my loose leaf paper out of your disc drive.

If you want both, try having a LAN party.

 

Well, for me, that was fine in the original D&D rules when there were only about 5 calculations you needed to make. But when you get up to the latest 3.5e rules, the number of calculations and numbers you need to keep track of has exploded exponentially so I would find it completely tiresome to do even one battle (unless you ignored half the rolls, but if you do that, what's the point of having all those stats and bonuses and spells and saving throws?)

So I think the point is that he would love to play with his mates AND be able to take full advantage of all the complicated stats and calcs involved in modern rules.

Not my cup of tea, but I can sort of see how it might appeal to someone.

 

HB, I started my live DnD sessions with 3.5 rules. I can never do anything easy.

 

• I always started mine with the excellent AD&D 2nd edition, with much less tables and numbers, and I LOVED it near 20 years, as I described at top of this subject.
• I love "pens & papers" games, AND I love BG computers games !

... But it is now the moment to imagine an other sytem, (or to comment my own idea at top of this topic) !

— Folks, we ALL know, by now, WHAT you prefer, Friends-&-Dices or Landscapes-by-computers !...
— Don't go ANYMORE in these two ways,
by Odin !

AND TRY TO IMAGINE a third and unexplored way !!!

 

To be honest, it's not become so much of what you are looking for in the future as it is of what RPGs (computer or otherwise) exist that satisify your gaming needs.

People have different views of what a good RPG constitutes. Some people like a game with lots of high-action combat, rolling dice, and a lack of character development. Some people like a toned-down game of modern intrigue or horror that is rules-light. Some people are in between or just prefer something else (or both!).

But for myself, I would really prefer to see Wizards produce a streamlined D&D game with lots of potential that doesn't require a lot of work to get running. Many games seem to just get so big that they eventually collapse under their own weight, hence causing reboots of new editions and new games. I'm not overly optimistic about the next edition of D&D, if it ever happens, but given that their RPG market is pretty glutted (nowadays any chump can write a PDF RPG and put sell it online) -- I do hope Wizards will put a new, quality game out.

I hope.

I used to sort of disagree with this view, but now I agree that D&D is just too complex in terms of rules. In fact, it's not only complex in some situations, but the complexity is unbalanced (combat is very complex; managing a social situation is rather simple in terms of rules). Other games do exist to support a fantasy RPG with less rules, though, but there's no doubt D&D is still the great granddaddy of all RPG's.

 

— I remind you, Oaz, that in MY imagined option for the future, I was telling about a << discreet black console on the ground >>, (below a extract from my text), then ... —>

—> ... then, that << discreet black console on the ground >> implies a form of CD, to project on the wall THE BASIC KIND OF PLAY you are hoping for, with the right skeletons of landscapes, (and so on) ...
Therefore, your :

... is NOT an argument against the option I have developped here, because change the game type necessitates ONLY a CD-like item to exchange in the console !

Perhaps, even, that the LCD wall (plasma sucks !) will can be, a day, replaced by a 3D-holographic projection in the half of the volume of the room, but for a close near-future I am not very optimist for that.

 

I think that Holodecks are still a few hundred years off according to Star Trek...

I think the game has a love hate relationship with technology. Sure a computer will simplify all the calculations and dice rolls faster, but it will never replace the human element. I'd like to see a Word pad document that shows the basics, a table with your weapons, a listing of your special abilities with all relevent text (not just an ability name). A CD with dozens of PDF files is a lot easier to carry than a suitcade full of game books...

But a computer will never replace the human element. A computer game is always too limited for my tastes, and would not be able to process what I encounter from my players (Arabian Skull Crusher through a table anyone?). Linear adventures work just fine if you get into them, but what if you don't want to do that mission right now? Do you sit there and run around like an idiot until you do feel like it?

 

Indeed, before fully working, absolutely brilliant AI is developed, you just can't have the same freedom in a computer rgp that you have in tabletop.

Me, myself, I agree with the rules in tabletop becoming more and more complicated. Actually, I mostly play a Play-by-post rpg now, and I like it very much. But those can't be developed (aside from automatic process that sucks your turn out from your head and transfers into the game, which could be more of a bad thing than a boon) too much.
Well, what I think will actually happen, is that games are mainly developed for the masses, who at this point seem to want action. So, I believe there will be more and more rpgs with the focus in hack-and-slashish style of play.

 

What I'd like to see is a combination of both. NWN had the right idea but failed in the execution.

In short, a PnP online with visualization but doesn't require a master's degree in C++ to be able to manage.

 

Depends on how you want to play the game, I guess. I can see a lot of fun -- even more fun -- with the action taking place foremost in the players' imaginations. Anyhow, what you've described is pretty far off, and I personally think video games suit that niche for me just fine. For an RPG, I will have the idea of having a fun narrative in mind first.

 

What I'd wish for is Virtual Reality mindsets, where your imagination shapes the visual representation of your character and the world around it.

A 'holodeck' of sorts, I'd say

 

This is a great idea but I think we can't see it to be implemented. It needs higher technology than we have and I think this technology will be achived in some decades; however, it will take very much time for normal people to have it.

 

Dynamic, indepedent, interactive singleplayer maybe? I wouldn't actually mind a text mode DM bot with real narrative skills. As for cRPG, that's obviously not the same as tabletop and the principle it's different: it's also a computer game.

Complete 3D immersion-simulation able to deliver smell and fake the wind that presses on your back would be too much. It would be like Matrix. We wouldn't need the real reality, having a virtual one. I wouldn't like that kind of thing.

What I need is not fancy graphics or sound. I just need nice storyline and narrative, and perhaps a bugless gameplay.

I less and less believe in pnp, though. I think anything real to do with friends would be better. A fencing tournament? Why not. Some historical reconstruction fun? Why not. Ren fair? Sure... But I'm becoming more and more disenchanted with the whole make-believe thing that goes on as real life passes by. It's like playing the Sims and immersing in the simulation of someone else's life instead of doing your own. I eat, I go to work, I sleep, I turn the computer on, I get a new job... Instead of actually doing that in real life. It can be fun in some situations, but normally I'd rather read a book.

 

• Perhaps are you going to laugh, but I think that the Faragon's idea will be FASTER to exist technically in the future than mine.
— But concentration of the mind on a "concret shape" in a difficult task for the most part of humans today, Faragon : your "Reality Mindsets" are a dream for numerous humans, — the largest number, by far.
It's HUMANS, there, who are not advanced enough, alas.

• To Chevalier :

Your Matrix allusion is interesting, but your Sims reference isn't (since there is NO fantasy dream) : it's obvious that simulating what are we ALREADY doing is a nonsense (my opinion is the Sims are a VERY BAD game).
But I well understand your "boring feeling" of all secondary worlds, Chevalier (except books are ALSO that !) ... In fact, you are more perceptive of the "mind saturation" which grows, more and more, even in marvellous fantasy settings.

— The problem is a metaphysical one, nay, even, a spiritual one. As the forum "Alley of Dangerous Angles" is made for this stuff, I shall tell only THAT, to be not too long time "off topic" :

RPG creates secondary worlds.
But spirituality suggest that WE ARE ALREADY in a secondary world, and that create "tertiary" dream worlds is NOT the solution, BUT search for OUR ORIGINAL PRIMARY world.

Chevalier is "saturated" and "disenchanted" (as saying the more-than-Goddess Mylène Farmer ...), but he isn't alone, and we have ALL more or less the same structural sickness .
The name of that sickness is BIOLOGIC LIFE, alas, since DIVINE LIFE seems out of reach for most of us, and no one send us useful advices or help — for now ...

 

I think that, if we're technologically capable of making a 'reality mindset' of sorts, cybernetics might be a way of ... upgrading our inferior bodies