Wisdom, charisma, intelligence and conversation options

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I know they modify game to lesser extent than in some other rpgs but can some one tell me what minimum stats are to get all(or almost all) dialogue options?

im planning to make a full BGT run, so both games included

 

I think I need to split the answer up. For wisdom and intelligence, so long as they are average (say around 10) you'll be fine. Charisma is a bit different. There are some conversation options you'll only get with a high (as in 18 or close to it) charisma score. High charisma scores also result in higher rewards for some quests. And finally, high charisma scores will get you better prices in shops. So the game definitely gives incentives for getting your charisma score as high as possible.

Keep in mind that it's not essential to have a high charisma score - you can go through the game with a charisma of 3 and complete all the quests - even having an average charisma of around 10 will give you 99% of the game's content. But charisma isn't something you're going to want to skimp on too much.

For wisdom and intelligence average is just fine. In fact, unless you're playing a mage or a cleric, there's no real reason to have either of them above 10. It's pretty standard practice to lower wisdom and/or intelligence down to 10 (again unless you're a mage or cleric) to have more points to spread around elsewhere.

 

INT is also nice to have if you're fighting mind flayers. One hit from them will drain your INT by 5 for a few rounds so if you have 5 or less INT, any hit by a mind flayer is an insta-kill.

Even if you want all speech options, you can actually still dump CHA, because you can get a ring that sets your CHA to 18 pretty much straight out of chateau Irenicus.

Actually, weren't there some options that were related to WIS in BG2? Or am I mixing up games here?

Anyway, BG isn't like PS:T or Fallout in that your stats can have a big influence on your speech options. Even in NWN your stats had more of an influence on conversations. As I recall, if your INT is below 8 or 9 in the NWN OC, you'll have less intelligent sounding speech options. Nothing as game-alteringly different as Fallout, but still.

 

yea fallout was pretty remarkable in that regard, especially talking with Tor with low intelligence was hilarious

Well for sure I'll put atleast 14-15 in CHA and try to roll enough to get at least 10 in WIS and INT perhaps I start with some character dependent on these stats so they don't go to waste; any advice on that?

 

There is a talk in Trademeet with a guy who claims to have slain a dragon that needs high wisdom (14??).
BTW I played with Charisma of 4 recently and it had very little effect on gameplay, 10 is definitely not worth the points invested, either pump it up or keep at the minimum IMO.

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I'm not sure that the talk in Trademeet is the only one that does such checks.

 

hmm interesting.. I guess Sorc would be nice because of the Wish spell- so it could serve two things at the same time, how much Charisma would you guys start with btw- basically always get the best NPC reactions assuming I start in BG1, 14,15,18?

 

I don't like to min-max my stats, just maxing them is ok, though Or at least, if in the portrait of my character he or she looks quite handsome or commanding (and lets be honest, you have to look quite hard to find something like that in the various portrait galeries), it doesn't feel right to put their CHA at 3 or something.

Same with the INT and WIS. It just doesn't seem to fit if I put their INT at 3, just because I'll be the brains behind him anyway and this isn't Fallout where the game actually limits your reactions based on INT. (And yes, I loved the 'dumb' conversation you could get with Torr.)

If you want to make use of INT and WIS, mages and sorcerers obviously have use for INT (actually, I'm not sure if sorcerers also need INT), and a high WIS will help you get better options with the Limited wish and Wish spells. A C/M will obviously make the most out of this combination, though.

 

They are rare but I do believe there are a few conversations in BG2 that a low Int or Wis will limit your possible responses.

 

It is true that you can get a ring very early on in BG2 that will set you Charisma to 18, so if you don't mind devoting one of your ring slots for this item, it's probably the easiest way to have a high charisma.

In BG1, there isn't an item that sets it to 18, but there are items you can find that will increase you Charisma by 3 from whatever it was initially (which, if you had a high charisma to begin can result in excess of 18). One is a tome that will permanently increase your Charisma by 1, and another is a cloak (which can be acquired very early) that will increase you Charisma by 2.

However, to answer the question at hand, the only way you can ALWAYS get the best NPC interaction is with a charisma of 18. However, most situations will require less than that, and oftentimes a lot less than that. This is probably best explained by example. So as not to spoiler anything, I'll give you two examples from very early on in BG1:

First let's go for one that requires a high charisma. The first is a mini-quest that you'll get while still in Candlekeep. An officer in the barracks will ask you to fetch him a quiver of bolts. Upon giving him the quiver, you will receive one of two rewards, depending on your charisma. If your charisma is 16 or less, he gives you some gold. If your charisma is 17 or more, he'll give you a dagger +1.

An example of one that it doesn't really matter what your charisma is unless it's exceptionally low, will be with some of the first NPCs you'll encounter that can join your party: Xzar and Montoron. When you encounter them, they tell you that they are planning on heading south to investigate the iron crisis, and want to proceed to Naskel and meet with the mayor. The most logical response to this question is that you will, but you need to meet up with some friends first at the Friendly Arm Inn. So long as your charisma is at least 7 (I think - maybe 6), they'll agree to accompany you to the Inn, provided you then proceed to Nashkel. If your charisma is under 6 or 7, they'll refuse and walk off.

The best advice I can give is that unless you plan on raising Charisma extremely high, it isn't worth the investment. It makes no sense to set your charisma to 11-14, because I'm not aware of any quest reward or option that changes based on that. I would say that you probably want to get your charisma to around 10 to avoid all negative reactions, but unless you want to go whole hog and jack it up to 18 (or at least 15 so that you can get it to 18 with the two items I mentioned), then those extra points are best spent elsewhere. Typically, the only time I prioritize charisma is when my PC is a class that requires a very high charisma to begin with - so basically a paladin, druid, or bard.

I assume you know this already, but you'll need to have a mod installed if you want to play a sorcerer in BG1. That was a new class added in BG2, and if you are playing the vanilla verison of BG1, that option will not be available.

 

I don't know if it's BGTutu, but I always get a ring that sets CHA to 18 from some random guy in the area north of Naskhel.

I haven't used BGT yet, but from what I can see, it's similar to BGTutu in that it's a conversion of BG onto the BG2 engine. So it would make sense that you'd be able to play as a sorc.

 

Thanks for reply Aldeth
Yes I know I need a mod for that I've installed BGT with some tweak packs
Yes you can play with all classes in BGT Henkie already made 1 playthrough like that but - it is not greatly balanced in some cases; like you get totemic animals or werewolf shape for druid that destroy everything early on- so i'll probably avoid these two and start with a bard or sorc, perhaps c/m not sure problem is i want these optimal conversation stats and a powerful character from beginning to end

Also I have a small side question; is there a stat for Bards and Sorcerers that limits their spellcasting abilities(like int for mages and wis for clerics), in other words is there anywhere Bards need 16 and sorcerers need 19 to cast 6th and 9th level spells respectively? If you can be bothered some advice how to put points in those classes(bard-blade / sorc)? I googled some topics but info there was unsatisfactory

 

In BG1 there is also a Helm of Glory, which adds another 1 point to CHA.

And as to CHA minimums - It's not a matter of CHA alone, but rather a CHA + Reputation combo.
http://forgottenwars.com/bg1/miscellany.htm#reaction
I don't think there are any encounters that require reaction over 15
So if you do the talking while having high REP, you can get away with lower CHA then you would otherwise. You could save some stat points and go to some temple, spend some money and play with REP 18 practically from the start. This way you'll get reaction of 15 with CHA 14. With REP 20, that you can get rather soon (if you know how ), 10 will do. And since you can have +3 to your CHA from items quite early, 7 is OK. Mages have a spell that increases CHA by 6, so 1 would be enough to get maximum benefit.

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Also, it should be noted that it's not that you have to do the talking with your PC. There are quite a few NPCs that have it at 16+.

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"I don't know if it's BGTutu, but I always get a ring that sets CHA to 18 from some random guy in the area north of Naskhel."
99% sure it's BGT only.

 

That must be in the BGT conversion - I have no recollection of ever finding a ring that sets CHA to 18 in any of the many, many playthroughs I've made of BG1.

Forgot that you said you're doing BGT.

With my mages, I always make a point of getting my intelligence to at least 18, but with my own mages and having NPC mages with intelligence less than 19, it appears that there is no restriction for casting spells based on your intelligence. For example neither Imoen nor Edwin have 19 in intelligence, and both of them can cast 9th level mage spells once they reach the appropriate level.

However, your intelligence does affect the chance of successfully scribing a scroll into your spellbook, and it also affects the maximum number of spells per level you can have in your spellbook. Both these limitations can be overcome if you drink a potion of genius right before you write spells. What I usually do is if I've reach the limit for spells at given level, I save up the scrolls I can't scribe until I get a bunch of them, drink one potion of genius, and then scribe them all.

 

The majority of conversations that require a mental stat have an average of 15 in either Wisdom or Intelligence. They tend to check one, the other or both is over a certain number to unlock the option so you can pretty safely just focus on one if you want.

Alternatively enable the cheat console, EnableCheatKeys() and at character creation hit Ctrl+8 which sets all stats to 18 meaning you can lower stats to what you deem reasonable to play through and still get the options you're after.

 

It's neither Tutu nor BGT that installs it, it's added by NPC1 Project

The ring is only given to characters with low CHA tough.

As to starting CHA: I'm in the camp that doesn't min/max, but chooses appropriate CHA score for roleplaying reasons. CHARNAME is the one the game is about and who gathers people around him or her to support him, it's hard to imagine CHARNAME doing that if he or she is very uncharismatic. Likewise, CHARNAME wouldn't able to sort out what's going on and why he or she is hunted if he/she didn't have at least moderate intelligence and wisdom.