An American's thoughts on world opinion

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I think the reason US citizens have this reputation for obesity because they have so much in terms of wealth -- I don't know the numbers exactly, but IIRC, a US citizen consumes significantly more calories/day than citizens of most other countries. Americans are used to this, and I don't think it's a real sin or anything, but some people may figure that US citizens don't appreciate the incredible fortune they have in their culinary abundance. So, they throw insults, expletives and stereotypes around.

You're right about the "uncultured slobs" sort of attitude taken by some Europeans -- conversely, many Americans take a "pretentious SOBs" attitude toward other cultures when discussing their culinary habits. Like many stereotypes, though, there is a little bit of truth at the center of such drivel.

 

There is no such thing as a free lunch.

 

Actually, there is such a thing as a free lunch:

http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/nothing/kfc.htm

Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

When you're right, your right.

Nothing says Americana quite like a cartoon mock of an American icon doin' the cabbage patch in a commerical for deep-fried left-over chicken parts.

*star-spangled banner plays in the background*

 

Depaara wrote

http://www.economist.com/markets/bigmac/displayStory.cfm?story_id=1537385

No, purchase power is not the problem, because a big part of the western world wields more purchase power than americans do. Therefore, food is cheaper for them (us).

The problem is, americans tend to eat more "wrong". Too much bad food = food with too much calories. Traditional European Food has the tendency (not always) to be more healthy, it has often more vegetables in it and it's preparation is different (not so much fat and oil).

For example, a burger compared to a khebab. khebab is the healthier (and better) kind of "fast" food.

Laches wrote:

Laches, that's it. The different life-style and the different way we eat, leads to big difference in obesity-statistics and the reputation of americans for obesity. I haven't meant that this causes "hate". But americans are "notorious" for being fat, so this is a common prejudice that exits outside the US.
And americans serve as "the bogeyman" for doctors in other countries:"Don't take on the wrong-habits of americans, or our children will grow fat too". It's really a big issue over here. Because obesity numbers start to rise outside of the US,

The point of Exercise. Average Americans do less exercise than average europeans. This has to do with "life-style" or "traditional behavior".

I think it has nothing to do with genetics, because (caucasian) americans are europeans (for example: Iirsh), therefore the Irish would have the same huge problems.

ahm, the part with who's working more and so. As European, I am used to the fact, that people of one country (falesly) say, that people in the neighbouring country work less than they do. When you travel in Europe a little bit around, it has something funny to it.

[ April 11, 2003, 15:38: Message edited by: Yago ]

 

Yago,

Not meaning to be argumentative, but what do you base your statement that most Americans are of German descent? I am not saying that you are wrong, but in my experience, the majority of white Americans cannot truly claim 1 predominant nationality that they descended from. I for example am a little over 1/4 German. I am also, Dutch, English, Scottish, Irish, Cherokee, Swedish, and Norwegian. I have ancestors who were from all of these places. I may be displacing my ancestry on others, but whenever the topic comes up, vary rarely does anyone I have spoken to claim more to be more than 1/4 of anything.

Now in minority groups this is a different story, but in the majority, I am not sure.

 

Ooops, no, that's not what I mean. But you just said yourself, americans are a mix of europeans, so I think genetics aren't the difference. And I don't want to imply, that genetics have nothing to do with obesity at all. It's just "individual" genes, not genes of a poulation.

You might also have Swiss-Ancestors, because from my country went 4 million overseas (mostly to the US).

But I change it to Irish

[ April 11, 2003, 15:43: Message edited by: Yago ]

 

Okay, not sure where to put this, but it was touched on here and I'd dearly like an answer. I've seen a number of people talk about the American electoral system not being "real" democracy or something of the sort. A number of these people happen to be British. Typically, the line is that this is supported by the fact that Bush didn't win the popular vote.

I contended that this doesn't really upset people that much, it is just another way of attacking Bush and America.

Well, yesterday I stumbled across this article regarding the antiwar movement, which included an interesting part:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/antiwar/story/0,12809,921358,00.html

It's the last part that's interesting. So, what gives? Why the criticism of the US electoral system on the basis of Bush being elected when there isn't any similar criticism, or even acknowledgment, for the Brits - this is a particularly relevant point for all the Brits who like to criticize the American electoral system for electing the person who didn't win the popular vote. You know who you are - what gives?

It is something of an ad-hominem I suppose, "hypocrite", but still interesting.

 

In my opinion, the electoral system problem is more a misunderstanding.

The problem is, the USA is a confederation. Confederations are not too common. I think less then ten Nations in the world are confederations, like India, Australia, USA, Canada, Nigera, Belgium and the Swiss confederation.

I think the Netherlands are also a kind of Union (confederation). But a different kind.

Except those countries above, no European country is a confederation, even if their offical names (Bundesrepublik, federal republic) are sometimes confusing.

What makes it even more difficult, is that the "latin" name confederation is misleading. The system of confederation is actually a invention of northamerican natives. (I know that in the USA, this is more than contreversial, in Europe, it is a more or less undisputed fact). The House of Commons and the House of Lords have nearly nothing to do with it, except that it used to be a double-chamber system too.

So, as Swiss, who's federal council is elected in nearly the same way as the president of the federation in the USA, through a gathering of the represantives of the people (conseil national) and of the states (conseil des etats), I am pretty used to the electoral system.

So, bottom line, if someone is not living in a confederation, which is the biggest part of the world population, the electoral system is pretty confusing.

The problem is not the electoral system, the problem is the Florida-Election. Who has won the votes in Florida, Bush or Gore. Well, I think regardless of the question who has won Florida or not, I think everyone would agree, that the Florida-Election was a disaster.

 

BTA wrote:

No, I don't think that everyone's vote is counted perfectly, nor do I think that elections are flawless. (Do I hear a mathematician speaking ?)

But I think a good administration is prepared for incidients like that and has a plan in the backhand to avoid a row of court-rulings and statements of officals which contradict themselves.

And in case of tight margins, there are even communities that use a die to settle things and decide, who has been elected

[ April 15, 2003, 17:33: Message edited by: Yago ]

 

Sorry, I know this is an old point but I only just noticed it.

My own experience is just the opposite. I've lived in France, Monaco and England, and in all three of those countries, even walking anywhere was considered bizarre. If God had meant you to walk, He would not have invented the motoscooter. Conversely, the Americans I know are always jogging or going to the gym. They are scarily fit. And they don't eat any fat, even when I slaved ALL DAY to make that vichyssoise, you bastards. Er- sorry. Bad recent dinner party with guests from New York.

 

Sprite: Yes, that's why a was so eager to put the word "average" in it. In the other thread, the one which laches put first, someone stated something like either extreme "fat" or extreme healthy and "fit". So, the people you cited are examples of the healthy extreme. (Which are seen in Europe quite often too).

Anyway, I also mentioned, that this developpement has reached Europe a while ago and people are getting worried that things in the whole might end up like in America. And the phenomena is usually linked with growing urbanization, or "city-life".

Lately I read an article, which brings up an interesting point. Those west-coast cities (I only know LA) are not build for walking at all. I mean no sidewalks. Whereas European cities like Kopenhagen or Amsterdam are like "hello, where's your bicycle ".

And there comes something else in my mind, because you live in France. Something in the way that people in France eat, is way healthier than what the people in the UK eat. But they don't know what. The best guess they got is wine, but they know nothing for sure. I don't know if you heard about that. They call it something like the "French-Paradox". In the end it means, that a lot of sicknesses which are related with "wrong" eating are in the UK more often than in France, but the French eat as bad.

By the way, yes my french is even worse.

 

Yes, that's what I mean. The citiy is build to drive, not to walk. Important buildings are not in walking or easy public transportation reach, you are forced to drive. It's not that you walk out the door and in 15 minutes, you can get everywhere you need to without taking a car.

 

After my almost always joybringing experiences with food in france I'd like to point out that dinner there is rarely done in less than 1 1/2 hours and includes wine, something like a salad or soup first, main meal, at choice either cheese or a dish afterwards (or both - in two seperate steps), and a cognac or armagnac as a final point. The seperate meals aren't that generous, however, it all adds up in you getting very well fed and beeing in a good mood for a lengthy walk.

In france it is absolutely common, even at lower income families, to do go to restaurant at the weekend or make real dinners at the weekend while eating hastily, spartanic even, under the week. Food is give a very high priority there; food professions are prestigious - highly specialised professions like cheesemaker, cheese storer, "preparer" who does nothing but preparing stuff to be cooked by others (while beeing able to earn his living from that) and so on. It's a totally different culture.

Maybe that brought a little light to the france paradox. And I second the statement of walking. That seemingly is much more a part of european culture than of americas. In the *by-car-only-areas* you'll be controlled by the police every third street because as a pedestrian you'll be suspicious; that happened to a friend of mine who was on holiday there. What will you do without a car when the next shop is 30 miles away? Or just 3 but acessible via highway only?

Think about drive-in's .... and US sweets and cakes - that I have *always* found to be "teeth-melting" sweet .... coke (which includes some 12+ sugarcubes per glass - german norm cubes; showing that is a popular school experiment to teach children healthy nutrition) .... ketchup (also including sugar in masses) you might get an idea of another aspect of the statistically fatter american. But without a doubt that doesn't apply to santa monica where people get probably imprisoned for not-jogging, not-exercising, smoking and of course, not-surfing

But hasn't anyone noticed we went seriously

[ April 16, 2003, 09:42: Message edited by: Ragusa ]

 

In Europe because of the two world wars and the consequence of starve these two wars had, there is a much more respect (sometimes is hysterical)for the food and meals in general. Also the history of eating habbits goes a long way in Europe and there were many diets that were created in European countries and are rather healthy because the folk couldn't get his hands on meat so easily.
As for walking USA is a vast country and this has affected the way the cities were build. Meaning that they were build using a larger scale than most European cities. Thus making the walking distances somewhat forbidding.

 

Mithrantir (hope i got the name right ), that with WW2 has something to it. But on the other hand, are traditional food and our food traditions are usally way older than the 20th century (as greek, I guess that's nothing new to you ).

And I just wonder, have you ever been to the US and ate what they call "bread" (Oh, I know that's a problematic statement, but it's my stomach's opinion) ? I cherish nothing more, than the bakery just around the corner.

And of course Swiss cheese which is actually Swiss cheese.