Armageddon

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Sarevok, in Singapore, they are imposing a $50,000 dollar fine on those who breach quarentine.

 

I'm talking about in the United States. Oh, and I'm not saying that no one is doing anything about it, infact I'm sure many countries are protecting us more than we are ourselves! It's just that on our cable news (CNN, Fox News, MSNBC) here they'll show about 5 hours of the same redundant war coverage for every 10 minutes about SARS. It's being pushed too far aside considering how much devastation it could cause if unchecked...

 

Where did you hear that? I've been trying to follow this story fairly closely and the last thing I've heard is that they've identified the virus and they're working on a reliable diagnostic test that can be administered rapidly. There's still no cure, only symptom-relief. That's a FAR cry from being "under control."

My concern regarding SARS is that the virus is in the same family as the virus that causes the common cold. How much has modern abuse of antibiotics contributed to this disease?

As far as SARS being a sign of Armageddon, has anyone heard of AIDS? That's a far more widespread and dire disease, IMO. Put me squarely in the Laches-Eze camp on this one.

 

AIDS might be deadlier, but is not as easily transmitted as SARS. SARS could be the pestilence mentioned, since it transmits easily, is deadly, and as yet has no cure.

As for what I said, the set of questions I ask is more of a guide, but then it should help people out in determining who the Harlot and Anti-Christ are: which nation closely matches the harlot? Which one has all its marks: domination in politics, military, culture, religion, morals? The second question actually is the crux of it all: one would notice that no other nation has dominated the world in all aspects in history, until now. Fulfillment? But I also understand that it would be hard for those who live or abide with that nation to accept such a notion. I would be glad if we are not yet in the Last Days. I don't think most people would want to know we're in such times, not even those who say they're "prepared". If we aren't, then be glad, since we can still do much, and maybe even possibly avert a harsh judgment. But if we are in such times, then it's best we are prepared. But how can one be prepared if one is not willing to listen, and instead try to say that such and such is not possible?

 

The plague was killing 10,000 people a day at one point. During this same time, the Byzantine empire was waging a massive war of expansion.

Lets compare that to, oh say, a three week war and a 'plague' in SARS that has killed 132.

Now, in comparison, do you see how ridiculous the claim that the '4 horsemen are riding' is? You want to see real tragedy on a grand scale? Rather than try to force a preconceived idea onto current world events just open up a history book. Or, just take a look at Africa -- but that wouldn't fit into the story would it?

 

Laches, right now there is larger threat of the activation of WMDs, at any time any country can cause more death, and don't forget even more rising tensions between France and the US, Syria and the US, Germany and the US, Russia and the US, and North Korea and the US. So if anything happens to break out, it would make the Bytzintine period look like a school yard fight.

 

Also, SARS is just starting. We do not know yet if it will reach the extent of at least a small epidemic, but it looks like it is spreading quite rapidly. Its danger is that its symptoms are so much like that of the common fever that detection of it is not easy--quite the perfect epidemic to spread. And as pointed out, with the proliferation of WMDs in many countries, diseases not seen anymore, or even diseases never before seen, can still be spread. There are still as yet 2 horsemen not out: death and famine. Death in a large scale, which might be brought about by the presence of any, or all, of the three other horsemen. So, are we near or not? If we ask Fundamentalist Protestants, they will say we are, though it might be hard for many of them to accept that the very thing they are looking for--the harlot and Anti-Christ--might be under their very noses. For has it not been said that these will come as like someone who speaks of peace, but actually means war? Kind of like how someone now preaches that peace can be achieved through war...

 

If Armaggeddon is close because there is conflict in the Middle East, then Armaggeddon has been close for about, oh, 2000 frigging years! As was mentioned earlier, all 4 "horsemen" or markers of the Apocalypse have been around at all times (and not just in the Middle East) for, well, ever. If we were to plot on a graph the intensity of those markers, even with the present conflict in Iraq, I don't think that the line on the graph would be any higher than usual, and given the fact that SARS is not anything close to something like Bubonic plague, the Red Death, or even polio, I'd guess that the line would be even smaller for this one year period than it has been several times in the past.

So, as my final response on this thread, be worried about what happens in the Middle East and with SARS, but don't worry about Armageddon quite yet.

 

And like I have to repeat, though seemingly the four horsemen were abroad in times past, also it has to be noted that the ingredients of having a real Armaggedon then were not all in place. For instance, in those times past, did man have any weapon that can destroy any given place with such swiftness and intensity as he has now? Yes, the Bubonic Plague was lethal, and it decimated 1/4 of Europe, but its spread, compared to the nuclear arsenals we have now, was relatively slow. So too, that diseases now can be transmitted wider and faster through air travel. So, you can see now that we actually have a much greater chance of ending humanity as we know it now than all of the past 2000 or so years combined! And with such swiftness, with such great weapons, that it would come true that "the living would envy the dead", as we read in Revelation. The past 2000, or actually the whole history of humanity, has not seen such destructive weapons as we see now. Consider as well that, ironically enough, some diseases like tuberculosis is harder to cure now because of the very same medicines we have made, the virus actually becoming immune, or at least more resistant, then before. It does not help any, to again add and repeat, that the most powerful, most influential nation that ever existed now occupies the very same land which, in Revelation, is the site of the harlot. It is quite critical in the next few weeks or months how events will transpire. If any more war in the Middle East is made--then I leave that up for people to conclude. Has anyone not noticed that, unlike in Afghanistan, it seems there is some slowness in forming at least an interim government in Iraq? What does this all mean then?

 

Well I think I get the part about the red dragon and all,I think it means that America (might not be it, but is the first country that comes to mind) granted power to Iraq(the red dragon) which "swept" the other Middle Eastern countries(the fallen angels) into anti-americanism. However, the Antichrist may be terrorist groups or dangerous world powers.

 

Might be, though if one were to look at how world events are unfolding, this does not appear to be so. One clue, other than Revelation, would be to read on Nostradamus. Nostradamus' writings on the Third World War and the Anti-Christ closely matches Revelation in many respects. The salient points of both are such: the Anti-Christ will take power or occupy the territory of Babylon, or present-day Iraq. The Anti-Christ has at his command such influence and power that nations look up to him in awe. The Anti-Christ has at his command as well the heads of nations. As we see events unfold, only one man and one nation fits all these descriptions. And by what happened recently, unless something else happens which might alter things, only one nation--and incidentally the most powerful nation on earth now--occupies that same place where Babylon was. Like I said, it is interesting what will happen in the next weeks or months, since it will either bolster more this view of who and what nation is being said which shall go against the holy ones of God, or this hypothesis of that nation will be proved wrong, and we are again back to searching who the Anti-Christ is. But then again, if indeed he has slowly unveiled himself now, would many believe? My fear, as again affirmed by Revelation, is that not many will believe, but indeed people will scoff at such a notion, until it is too late for most.

 

Deadly?? The change SARS will be letal is 4%, that is as much as a common flu...

Oh and Nostardamus, how much of his predictions proved true, I read some books about him and had trouble finding a prediction that proved true..

Maybe he just read the bible

I give you one, Nietzsche

[ April 20, 2003, 16:35: Message edited by: Morgoth ]

 

This is also being discussed like it's a new idea; all of the 'signs' have been 'in place' so many times throughout history that the chicken littles of the world prepare for the beginning of the end quite regularly. Even back as early as the crusades (and before) the idea of armageddon has been bandied about, and so far we're all alive and kicking. It's one of those things that's perfect for people who are extremely open to suggestion, and it's a lot like horoscopes; you can make the examples fit any scenario if you try hard enough. and really, if you believe in armageddon and the end of the world and the second coming of christ and all that, then you know well enough that what you believe isn't going to effect what is or isn't going to happen. So really there's no point in speculating. Besides, I think there's several verses in the latter half of the new testament that talk about it being a folly to try to guess or postulate or surmise when the second coming is.

 

Well SARS itself is not disturbing, but the prospect of some other viruses, that we have not encountered yet is. So really, I think SARS is just a herald to times that will come.

 

The difference now and then is that then WMDs, such as nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons, were non-existent. What, end of the world can be brought about by an army weilding swords and shields, and half of that army decimated by the climate and disease even before it can reach its destination? Compare that with the weapons we now have...I think you can go into the conclusion on that point alone.

 

Y'know, just to clarify a bit, maybe three horsemen'll be at work during the Apocalypse, whenever that may be. Jesus is often interpreted as the one on the white horse.

In the Left Behind series, it was defined as conquest, possibly the Anti-Christ. So views differ.

As for all the "last battle and Anti-Christ" lies and feces, well, it's hard to discern when it's "just" happening and when it's happening because it's the end of the world.

[ April 21, 2003, 14:51: Message edited by: C'Jakob ]

 

A. I don't belive in the bible anyway

B. The world hasn't got to end to be real bad place. The four hoursemen alone riding is bad enough. Bottom line: Maybe in some parts of the World they now got real reason to be worried, it's going to be their turn and that the four Horsmen and espacially the Mongols come knocking on their door.

[ April 21, 2003, 15:45: Message edited by: Yago ]

 

Dragon's Jewel makes a very good point. Even Christ himself does not know the time of His return. God alone does, and it is not for us to try and determine.

 

Umm...C'Jakob, in Revelations, the horseman on the white horse is Pestilence. The other guy on the white horse leading the heavenly army is called King of Kings, so yeh it's Jesus.

 

Agreeing with Laches and Eze.

Sure, bring on the Armageddon. Bruce Wills went that way.

(Who, me, cynic?)