BG2 vs. NWN... BG2 is better, isn't it?

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I've finally finished NWN and it was an experience. Not very good and not really bad. Just an experience. How would you rate the way BG2 stacked up when it came out years ago(single and multi) to games of its time? And how NWN rates in its era? Which one rated higher when it came out? Was BG2 a better game in 2000 then NWN is in 2002? I think so, and that is an argument to say it is a better game.

 

Thankyou Sirdan! And for clearing that up.
People get bored of Bg2 quickly, NWN will never get booring as long as there is a fan-base for it.

 

BORED OF BG2????

I have beaten it around 12 times, and I might do it again (if I will have time).

BG2 is a perfect compromise between the size (and the complexity) of the game and the dynamics. If the game is too dynamic (Diablo 2) it becomes boring. If the game is too complex and long (EoB 1,2,3,.. anyone) then it is a PITA.

BG2 is a very clever and thought-through game, and I don't know any game that is better for me.

As the graphics goes, I HATE 3D animations. I only like 2D in isometric projection (at least for the CRPGs) - FO1&2, IWD, BG1&2.

 

OK, OK, I'll say this for BG2: it had a better story and better characters, but that's it! Even when BG2 came out I was sorely disappointed with its music and sound, it quite frankly sucked (though there were some good pieces of music here and there.) ToB made up for it on the music side of the game and made BG2 even more interesting, but that is it. BG2 will always be a classic CRPG but it's time to move on. In every other aspect of gameplay NWN is superior including the D and D rules that it uses! and that is an extremely important point to consider. I play a great deal of pen and paper D and D and the 3rd Edition rules is a breath of fresh air, and implementing them in NWN was the best thing that Bioware could have done.

 

Categories
Graphics: NWN
Story: Bg1
Sound: Bg2
Music: Bg1
Characters: Bg2
Campaign: Bg1/NWN with editor
Multiplay: NWN
Cost: Bg1
Quests amount: Bg2
Quest quality: Bg1
Character builing: NWN
Dialogue possibilities: NWN

 

IMHO the Bottom line

If you are ONLY comparing the single player NWN vs BG2 BG2 is better, hands down. There is alot of hype on here about the possibility of modules made with NWN being great. I hope and expect that they will be. But as far as excitement, originiality, and fun are concerned BG2 beats the single player module that shipped with NWN.

Don't get me wrong. NWN is fun. But playing it for the first time wasn't nearly as exciting as BG2, or even BG for that matter.

 

Turandil, no offence but are you insane..

Sound: Bg2 .. NWN by far the background noise beats the music of bg2 in my book

Cost: Bg1 .. Surely this should be relative, other wise cost you be DnD at your mates house.

Quest quality: Bg1 O_o wtf, please help me I have a nasty gerbil infestation kill all thouse 5 rodents.
Or
Please go to the other side of town and fetch me that item for a bucket load of experience.

 

I think that Mr Writter hit it spot on. That dude does not sound, well, shall we say, normal. Back to the topic however, the replayability of the game is there due to the fact there are so many quests and you can never get all of them, to own the thieves guild, the planar sphere and nalias keep you need to play the game three times alone. Not to mention all the combinations of NPC and the quests that come with them. I also have to agree with the fact that comparing BG2 when it came out in 2000 and NWN in 2002, it was BG2 that i was excited about more, because it really was the game to play. Now, Morrowind, that is a game i would like to stick my teeth into. BG2 was a better game in 2000 then NWN in 2002 but Morrowind is definetly better in 2002 then NWN is. I mean, you can finish the central story and still keep playing. the only downside to MW is the loneliness, that was absent in BG2 and is absent in NWN. BG2 rocked its age, NWN will not rock its age however.

 

I liked the story and NPC-character interaction of Baldurs Gate II/TOB MUCH better than NWN.

The third edition rules (which NWN usually follows) is much superior to second edition rules. I hope to see modules that are superior to the one offered with NWN in the future. I am still hopeful that I can get online multiplay with a group.

So, the award for best game must go to NWN (if you have a sufficiently powerful computer to run it) for its POTENTIAL, rather than what was sent as a single player module.

 

You say that Party interaction is better in Bg2? So are you saying that when you're online, in the village you made, discussing the upcoming adventure with your best mates online in a tavern, that's not better Party-Interaction?

Ok, clear this ip once and for all:
Multiplayer: NWN
Singleplayer: BG2

There, done and dusted.

 

It's not done with!

I don't play anything online nor I plan to (unless someone finaly makes uncheatable MP game, please don't start with games you don't know how to cheat in so you thing those can't be cheated in...).

So if I get you right, the last game I should buy is NWN.

No, I'm not interested in Aurora (based on the screenshots) nor modding with the bad NPCs' AI by default nor I care for any Toolset because anything similar I can do with BG2. I don't see something for myself in NWN. Should I buy it just to confirm my expectations that it was overhyped?

 

Mr Writer

Ok, must agree witht the sound stuff, now when I have listened through carefully.

And it was not realy fair about the price cuz bg1 is must older...But anyway, its cheaper...

Bg1 have some silly quests, so have the other, though NWN have a little less because the linear story, but somehow, I don't know why, I really enjoyed the bg1 quests...
Some are good to ye know....

 

Extremist, based on what you've said, I would have to say that No, i don't think you should buy NWN. I myself bought NWN simply for the use of the Toolset, I haven't even played NWN past Chapter 1 yet, and im only playing that to look up Scripts and C++ code used in the main game.
Truth be told, and from what I had heard before the games release, I didn't even know there would be a single player game.
The fun for me is in creating your own world, and though it may not seem like it, the possibilities are endless if you know what to edit, and what to look for.
So, i don't think NWN is the game for you.

 

I don't have it yet, but am looking forward to building my own modules. I have lowered my expectations about the single player game (significantly after reading some of the reviews), but I am sure it will be fun.

 

Here are a couple of quotes from the game makers at Bioware concerning NWN. I pulled this off Gamespot(GS). They interviewed Ray Muzyka and Greg Zeschuk(GZ).

GS: If anything, Neverwinter Nights' campaign was a big surprise. Are you happy with the overall response to it? Any plans to address some of the common criticisms, such as the relatively easy difficulty, the overabundance of locked items, and the two-character group restriction?

GZ: The response to the campaign has been very interesting--a lot of people have been very happy with the campaign and the way it unfolds. Before release, we said that its story would be as involving as anything we've done in the past, and we still believe that is true following release. The manner in which the story is told is very different from that of the Baldur's Gate series, and it seems this surprised some people.

Translations for the non-politician
Comment:"The response to the campaign has been very interesting--a lot of people have been very happy with the campaign and the way it unfolds."
Real Meanings:
"very interesting" means people didn't like it
"a lot of people have been very happy" means that most people weren't very happy

"Before release, we said that its story would be as involving as anything we've done in the past, and we still believe that is true following release"
Real Meanings:
"Before release" means they planned to do it all along
"we said that its story would be as involving as anything we did in the past" means we didn't do much work on the story but Baldurs Gate story was soo good that you will buy this game for the single player aspect hoping for something as involving as BG.
we still believe that is true following the release" means that our previous statement got you to take the bait and we sold a gagillion copies.

"The manner in which the story is told is very different from that of the Baldur's Gate series, and it seems this surprised some people. "
Real Meanings:
"The manner in which the story is told is very different." means that we didn't really come up with anything new or interesting.
Comment: "from the BG series" means that they are distancing NWN story line from BG but still dropping BG's name to sell more copies.
"it seems this surprised people" means that people are peeved about being led on.

Whoops got on a roll and couldn't stop.I stopped myself before going into the locked chest, and henchmen questions.

[This message has been edited by Slackertoast (edited July 24, 2002).]

 

Both are extremely great games, but let me put it this way: BG2 is better than NWN when there is a cold day in hell

 

I havent played anything else but single plyer till now in NvN but that realy sux compared to BG2. Its rather a little altered Diablo 2 than BG2.
And i realy dont like character creation >you get 30 points and thats it. No rooling for hours which i adored in BG series. Perhaps its becuose of the rules i dont know. another thing i dont like> rules. it is so simplified- saving throws reduced to 3(reflex, will fortitude). Even critical hit is a bit weird i got mine to 14-20 that means more than 25% hits are critical.
Too easy single player.
And i think fighter is overpowered when he begins he can have
20 str
12dex doesnt need more -heavy armor=dex bonus 1
16con
AND he gets tons of feats enabling him to improve his saves (which are at least that poor) gets ultimate archer and dualwielder.
Multiclassing . I dont expect to see any single class anymore becouse it just is not worth it. Recepie is get some like 9 levels of fighter to get a lot of feats. Then add 7 levels of rogue to get sneak attack=backstabb damage and disarm traps, opening locks, setting traps,...
And then add a level or to as you wish.
I ended up a 10 level ranger 3 level rogue and 1 level fighter.

XP sistem doesnt work. I like the idea to get less XP from a same monster when you are higher level. But these rewards can be soo altered. I peninsula district where prisoners escaped you can get 9 xp per prisoner. But if you do i-dont-know-what you can get over 100xp for one man down.

Its just without proper restrictions. XP reducement doesnt work - you can be max level in chapter 3.

But that was just single player game. When i played to chapter 3 i just had enough of such crap and decided to go BG2 again with a druid
I think NvN will become better single becouse of complet freedom in mod creating. So i expect i will play it in half a year or something when enough mods comes out.

 

Graphics: BG2

It's hand drawn art Vs polygons, and frankly there are much better 3D engines around. BG2 wins here. Look at a NWN house, look at a BG2 house. BG2 has a large number of unique locations, while NWN reuses tiles.

Story: BG2

Come on! NWN has a time travelling lizard in a fantasy setting! It was dire.

Sound: BG2

Music is very much a matter of taste, but the NWN voice acting was just *bad*!

Characters: BG2

That's easy, BG2 had interactions, romances, quests, stories... NWN was far too limited.

Campaign: BG2

The BG2 campaign was infinitely more interesting. The fact that new ones can be made for NWN is irrelevant.

1. This can be done for BG2 (and is easier in some areas while being harder in others)

2. Some people who buy the game don't have net connection.

3. You're betting good mods will come out. You only have to look at Deus Ex to know it may not happen for a long LONG time... not to mention nothing on the scale of BG2 is going to happen.

Counting stuff outside the box is a bad joke. If NWN shipped with nothing but the tools would this be OK and worthy of your money because one day someone may make a game to go with it?

Multiplayer: NWN

The problem really is that mutiplayer is here as one category... yet single-player gets several? How is that fair?

If you want to have an AD&D game with people you're going to love NWN a hell of a lot more than BG2. If you want an epic single-player experience than BG2 is for you.

The NWN engine is not cutting edge, it is not close to cutting edge and it is never going to win any awards for looks. A hill is still not a hill... what kind of 3D engine is that?

As for modding... NWN is slighty ahead, but in terms of what you can do with the game, it is barely more moddable than BG2.

 

Hey enough BG bashing already!!! How quickly you forget!

Aren't NWN and BG essentially incomparable given that BG is party based and NWN is more single character orientated. I've not played NWN but BG, SoA and ToB took me around 4 or 5 months to complete back to back that makes for a MASSIVE game. You can't really ask for much more out of an RPG than BG gives. NWN sounds like a totally different game, it uses different rules and from what I understand the character building is different too with regard to class. I've still not decided whether to get that next or buy Planescape Torment first. But NEVER tell me that BG is outdated... Tal how could you have let this travesty occur on a BG forum??

 

Everyone is bagging on the fact that NWN's SP campaign can't compare to BG2. Of course it can't! NWN is a multiplayer game, BG2 is single-player! There originally wasn't going to be SP at all in NWN. About there not being any good mods, I won't agree with you. We've seen lots of good mods for BG2, why do you think there won't be for NWN?