Burka Babes

NOG (No Other Gods) · Jul 21, 2009

Remove all ads!

Aldeth the Foppish Idiot said: ↑

Well, the Latino population of Maryland is only 6%, so perhaps I'm just not as exposed to it as you. I, however, have not seen any instances of a child refusing to learn a new language. In fact, if the child attends school, it's almost impossible to refuse to learn a new language - you're going to pick it up simply through exposure. My grandparents learned English by going to school - and they didn't have any fancy ESL programs back then. They learned English by being exposed to it on a daily basis. (And it was almost exclusively through school, because they still spoke their native language at home as their parents did not speak English.)
Click to expand...

And when you only have 6% of the population, that's ok. When you have 40-50% of the population in a community, and localized in a subset of that community, as some areas in southern California do, you have schools run by Latinos for Latinos in Spanish and, since the US has no official language, that's fine. The Wal-Marts are run in Spanish, the DMVs, everything. At that point, integration becomes almost impossible.

As for speaking their immigrant language, I see it like this:
Speaking the national language (or for the US the vastly major language) when dealing with strangers or official business is a matter of common sense. If 99% of people in the country speak that language, then that's the most likely one to be understood.
Speaking the national language when dealing with a fellow immigrant (or otherwise someone you know speaks your language) but in front of strangers (or those who don't) is a matter of politeness. I'd like to see it, I'd like to see it more, and I respect those that do it, but it's not required by any means.
Speaking the national language when immersed in your own community only serves as practice. That may be important for some, less so for others, but should definitely NOT be mandated, and I have no problem with a Latino man going home to his Latina wife and speaking Spanish.

Drew · Jul 22, 2009

Ziad said: ↑

I'm not so sure I agree with you on this. They want to speak it when they're among themselves as a group? Sure. I do it all the time and wouldn't stay a second longer in a country that didn't let me do that. But speaking it when you're in a social situation with other people? I think that's pretty rude. Interrupting other people's conversations to speak with one of them in your native tongue, which the others who were participating in the conversation don't understand? Beyond rude. Refusing to go to a shop unless you can speak to the shopkeeper in your native language, or trying to get employment with immmigrants from your country (or just general area) because you don't want to speak the country's language? I think that's a good indication of integration problems. If you're the shopkeer, being curt and rude to local customers because you can't be bothered speaking the language of the country you have immigrated to (doubly worse if you actually do know it and can speak it)?
Click to expand...

All of these things happen in the US, too. I just don't have a problem with it. Rudeness is legal, some businesses cater almost exclusively to immigrants (as a vegan who finds it easier to just eat ethnic food, I patronize many of them), Mexican restaurants (and, for some reason, landscaping companies) tend to be run by Mexicans, and I simply have no problem with it. I only see a problem when the children of these people fail to learn English.

Ziad · Jul 22, 2009

I don't have a problem with (to take your example) Mexican restaurants being run by Mexicans. In fact I wouldn't go to one if it was run by an American, or a Frenchman, or whatever. But let's say you walk into this restaurant and find all the menus are only in Spanish - something is definitely wrong in such a scenario.

Drew · Jul 22, 2009

Ziad, I see nothing wrong with this. French restaurant menus are often entirely in French, and most people seem to have no problem with it. Why should Mexican Restaurants be any different? You don't have to eat there, after all.

Aldeth the Foppish Idiot · Jul 22, 2009

NOG said:

When you have 40-50% of the population in a community, and localized in a subset of that community, as some areas in southern California do, you have schools run by Latinos for Latinos in Spanish and, since the US has no official language, that's fine.
Click to expand...

I have heard of that. While they are evidently quite rare, even in areas with a large Hispanic population, there are some public schools in the US that are taught exclusively in Spanish. That I DO have a problem with. It's one thing for businesses and services in an area dominated by Hispanics to speak Spanish. In fact, that makes good business sense. However, to teach school in Spanish gives up on the idea of integration all together.

T2Bruno · Jul 22, 2009

They have SSL (Spanish as a second language) classes -- that should count a little towards integration...

Taluntain · Jul 22, 2009

Ziad said: ↑

I don't think there's anything wrong with us speaking our language when we're among each other (and I think Tal and NOG will agree with me), but that doesn't mean we can create our own state within a state and pretend that the "other" country doesn't exist.
Click to expand...

Yup. Obviously I don't expect the immigrants to forget about their language altogether, but there's a time and place for it, and it's not "any time and anywhere".

Log in or Sign up

Burka Babes

NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

Drew Arrogant, contemptible, and obnoxious Adored Veteran

Ziad I speak in rebuses Veteran

Drew Arrogant, contemptible, and obnoxious Adored Veteran

Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran