DA2 Pre-order

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@Marceror
It doesn't hurt to read something like this, I know it already .
I just don't accept this ultra liberal point of view in economics, how all is good when just the money is good. Money justifies all, to put it a bit polemic.
By the way I don't want to start a debate of what is better, liberalism, socialism or the hundreds of ways in between or which ethics should be honored, for this my English debating skills aren't good enough.

Anyway, gaming is just a hobby of mine, and there are tons of more important things out there, but it still annoys me.
I find it a bit narrow minded to see an agenda like the one of Ricitello as the only option to 'save' the PC gaming market.
In my humble opinion, it should also be possible and profitable, to honor more the right of the customer.
It is not that there are positive examples that show how customer friendly gaming distribution and profit can go hand in hand.
Stardock and 'Sins of a Solar Empire' would be such an example.
Or back in the days, Baldur's Gate, wasn't it profitable? Of course it was.

 

The problem with the gamer today is that they like to buy the games used or they pirate the games. It is this venue where companies like EA can add DLC content to still generate a revenue stream even though they are not selling additional copies of their games. There is nothing illegal with this type of activity; in fact it is a good way for a company like EA to stay in business and allow their developers to continue to produce quality games.

Depending on the game I may or may not purchase the DLC. So far I am not 100% into ME like I was with DAO. ME is a great game but it is by no means DAO and I am absolutely not going to waste any money on any DLC that EA or Bioware has to offer. I can’t comment on ME2 yet, but at least for ME1 it is not worth it in my opinion. Than again, I got the Platinum copy and it contained some of the DLCs so I installed those since it was part of the purchase.

As for DAII; I believe it is worth pre-ordering. Will the standard copy contain some of the content on that the SE edition will contain. My guess is yes. I believe the standard edition may contain the extra character and the quest to go along with that character; just like DAO did. However, like DAO the SE will have extra items and one full DLC quest that can be purchased through PSN, Xbox Live or Bioware website.

I have no regrets with pre-ordering the game. In fact, I wish I would of pre-order DAO and purchased the SE or CE copy instead of the standard edition. I’m looking forward to this game being released.

 

Believe me, this has been this way since the first commercial games had been released. That's really not only a problem of today but has been so always.

 

It is now more of problem than it was 10-15 years ago and the reason being that there are now more people who use computers than 10-15 years ago.

 

I think it's the gaming industry that has changed much more than it is the players.

Back in the Baldur's Gate days, the gaming industry was much more about a passion for gaming, and game developers were often run by people who were gamers first, businessmen second (if at all). These companies would go way beyond the call of duty to make their games something they were truly proud of, even if some of their decisions didn't make the best financial sense.

Sure, they made money in this "golden age of game development", but it clearly wasn't enough for them to remain independent over the long-haul, at least, not for the majority of them. I'm sure that a company like Bioware would prefer to be independent, but its numbers clearly weren't what they needed to be. So it got assimilated (better than dying outright, as has often happened with others).

What these larger organizations like EA lack in gaming passion, they make up for in business savvy. They pull together teams to address problems like their fans creating a "used" market for their games. They think outside the box to make sure that the revenue is coming in, and that the expenses are watched closely. This is good for business. Not always good for the game.

So really, the difference is that game development, by and large, is now part of the corporate machine, and many of us yearn for the days that it wasn't so. If it could be any other way, I'm sure that it would.

 

@Marceror
That's someting I can agree with you, at least in essence.

Nevertheless, some small independent developers show, that game development without the big business guys is possible without dying. Even while being profitable - maybe not in the millions.

But you said it very well with the word 'passion'.
That's something I associate with art, the joy to build something.
And art and big business don't go very well together. At least not the Ricitello way of
business.
I simply use my right as a customer and refuse to buy. That's all i can do, so I'll do it.
It's not that I feel that I forcefully withdraw myself from something I might enjoy. As
a matter of fact, in the last 10 years, I've experienced a gentle but steady drop in overall game quality anyway with some exceptions.
Things like complexity, extensiveness and the hard to grasp 'passion'.
This is a bit stealthed by a shinier surface nowadays.
And that's just the pure game design aspect.
What annoys me in the first place is the customer hostility.

Let's take a car.
Surly, if the car producers could hinder people to buy used cars they would make more profit, logical, isn't it?

Or what about a good novel?
I wonder why there isn't yet a bigger market for EBC Extra Buyable Content (or DLC in digital distribution, even easier ^^), that 'enhances' the same novel by new twists and characters in between the story.
I just throw the words 'artistical cohesiveness' in here, would get too far to debate about it.

Or what about to force the owner of a DVD to, say once in a week, let himself verify,
if he uses the original and not a copy?

I leave it with these, I guess you get my point.

@Munchkin Blender
Your reasoning is a bit flawed.
More games more illegal copys, naturally.
Though the percentage of pirates would still be the same (with some fluctuations).
That means the damage done by piracy remains steady from a percentage viewpoint.
Of course, the higher volume nowadays results in a bigger absolute number concerning profit loss to piracy.
But the relative loss remains more or less equal.

 

Companies are in business to make a profit. If they can earn extra revenue for charging for ingame content, than so be it. Most of the Facebook and Apple games earn revenue this way, so why not Bioware. I was planning on buying DAII, so by pre-ordering I will receive free DLC that is worth $20. That to me was worth it. However, if you want to wait until the Ultimate Edition is released in 2012 than go ahead as that is your choice.

As for developers and earning profits, it is dependent on the size of the company. Since Bioware is a multi-million dollar company than profits of $250K a year will not be justified; however, if they were a start-up company or one that just broke over one million in revenue in profit than it maybe ok to earn $250K in profits on one game. Profit is relative to the size of the company making the game.

As for developers making good independent games; Bioware did a fantastic job with DAO. In fact, I prefer it over Baldur’s Gate. I like the story better it and the combat along with the monster were mostly new and original. Can we say that about Baldur’s Gate? No. The combat system was used in prior games that followed the AD&D rules and the story within the game was far from original. Also, your action didn’t really have an impact to the game world. DAII is going to be slightly impacted by the decisions the Warden made in DAO. I wonder how much of an impact but an impact is an impact.

 

What game is better than any other is subjective for the most part.
I can but describe what I like and don't like about game design.
And when in your opinion DAO is better than BG, I'll accept it.

Anyway I'm more concerned how game distribution and customer rights have shifted over the years for the worse.
In this case it is EA (owning Bioware), but Activision and Ubisoft (Ubisoft might be even worse) aren't any better.
I tried to make some of my concerns clear in my above examples.
I put up with with the issues of DRM mechanisms and DLC politics in the latest Bioware games so far,
but now I won't tolerate this anymore, not buying DA2 is just a final stroke in this regard.
Others don't see any problems according to business is business and money must be earned sentiments, I beg to differ
and pointed out why, but I'm ok when someone doesn't agree with my viewpoint.
I just wanted to express my concerns ^^.

 

I'm almost certainly going to get DA2, but I've decided to be a wussy-pants and wait for the reviews. I was going to pre-order both DA2 and Dead Space 2 (with an online EA coupon I had, now expired) but hesitated. Dead Space 2, it seems, would have been a safe bet. Reviews are pouring in that it's even better than the original. But I'm starting to have by doubts about DA2, so...we'll see.

For the record, I really hope the consensus around here - which seems to be that it's going to suck and was ruined to mainstream it - is wrong (as do we all, I'm sure). But I can't say the complaints here aren't without merit.

 

You big wussy-pants!

I'm going to make a prediction. Dragon Age 2 will NOT suck.

Bioware has a strong track record (one of the strongest out there) with their PC games. I simply don't believe they are going to "blow it" on the sequel to a highly successful new IP. Some of the recent interviews and previews about the game, in my opinion, have been extremely promising, showing a game that looks good, has a compelling story and characters, and I even think combat is looking pretty promising. The narrative approach is intriguing and I applaud Bioware for pushing the envelope.

I'm not without my concerns, like most around here, but I don't believe that DA2 will be the game where Bioware blows it for me. And if I'm right, and they CAN create a great PC game that also has major appeal to console monkeys... that's good for us PC guys, I think. That means Bioware will be able to justify big budget additions to the game going forward.

Now, if you're determined to play a dwarf, you're screwed. If you're determined to play a character who isn't named Hawke, you're screwed. If you absolutely hated the Mass Effect approach to dialogue, I guess you're screwed there too. If you greatly preferred the original art style, well, adapt, I guess. The more I see this game, the better it's looking.

I'll come back here and eat my words if I don't love the game after it's released, but I don't think I'll have need to do that.

 

I heard the game is going to have more depth with the PC development than DAO and there was little to change how combat or skills are used, which is great. The biggest change is that the game provides the PC with a last name and that is how most people that know you or heard of you will address you instead of just calling you warden. The other change from DAO to DAII is that your character is voice over. The voice over worked well in ME series why not the DA series.

As for other changes, depending on actions and conversations selection you character voice over is suppose to change from nice/pratical good natured voiced to acting like a complete ass/jerk.

From the reviews I have read from people who got glimpse of DAII most stated that it will surpass DAO. I can’t say that for myself as I have yet to see it; however, it does look like Bioware will have another high quality game released in the near future.

Death Rabbit you should of pre-order it. I know I will be posting here after my first hour of gaming on 3/8/2011 about my experience with DAII.

 

If though you missed the SE copy if you pre-order it now you still can get some DLC goodies.

 

I still say it, extra content will not persuade me from waiting for reviews.

 

I'm assuming the extra stuff includes the sword/shield they added to current pre-orders post January.

Nice to get to play a new game developed by a company you like despite other people telling you it's going to be bad, but waiting for your reviews before they get it . I pre-ordered it as soon as it was available for pre-order, not regretting it since atari/obsidian had nothing to do with its development.

 

Just because a review says it is postive does not mean you will agree with the review. I find half of the games that get great reviews I dislike and never play.

Download the demo and go from there. If you like it; pre-order so that you can get some free goodies; if you don't like the demo. Wait and buy the game later on down the road.

 

I pre-ordered.

 

I just have a rule for DAO DLC's. Extra missions/characters/story - all good. Extra items - wait for player made mods .

For an RPG all that matters is that you like the story and you like the combat. (Pool of Failiance anyone?). There are a lot of complaints about changes - get over it, the game is unique so you're not going to play the exact same character you played for DA:O 10 times through already .

As for the money - there's always the option of waiting. But the less money you invest in buying a new game, the less chance you're going to have of getting a better next game. If every gamer waited years or stole the game, how many games do you think the company would make next?


Lastly, I think it's time we got rid of all these online-downloads :-P. We gotta leave our homes and go to stores if for no other reason than to force the gamer to learn to interact with real life human beings right?!?!?!?!

 

If you play Dragon Age on consoles there are no fan made mods.

 

I'm counting the days. I need to try to get a day off work or something for this -- that's a near impossibility for me these days, but where there's a will, there's a way I guess.

I'm not thrilled about everything I've heard about the game, but I plan to go into it with an open mind, and enjoy it for what it is. If it ends up feeling overly "consolized" this may be my last game in the series... but I'm ready to roll on this one!

 

I went back to Baldur's Gate 2 the other day, and I just couldn't play through it again. The interface was clumsy, the rules were confusing and highly restricting, the AI was poor... it just didn't flow gameplay-wise. And BG2 was probably my favourite game of all time.

Using the AD&D ruleset doesn't make sense anymore in modern computer RPGs simply because it's no longer necessary, and they take so long to learn that they detract from the gameplay. The Dragon Age system is extremely elegant and only needs a few tweaks here and there to become great. I really am impressed from a game mechanics designer's point of view.