Diablo II Single Player Thread - 2

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If you didn't have Howl, I would see the point. If you ran into a tough boss pack, you could lead the pack back to an area where there was a corpse, cast GW, and then have the boss one-on-one while all the rest fled. With Howl though, that does the exact same thing, except that you don't need a body. The only thing GW has going for it is it works all the time. Howl only works if the slvl in Howl + clvl > mlvl. If you have echoing weapons equipped, that's almost always going to be the case, unless you really rushed your way through the game.

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Remember how I said this is going to be a high life build? It's going to be more like an insanely high life build. I think a low-ball number would be 3k once I get to level 80-something. Consider how low my strength and dexterity investment needs to be:

The highest dexterity piece of equipment I will need to equip is, of all things, the small crescent axe, which has a surprisingly high requirement of 83. But, I have a +20 Dex Ravenfrost, I get +10 from credendum, and I get +2 from Shako, meaning I only have to raise Dexterity to 51, and you get 20 when you create the character.

For strength the calculation is a little trickier. The highest strength requirement is 138, for the berserker axe. You invest up to 106. That enables you to complete the disciple set, which gives you a bonus of +20 to strength (10 from credendum, 10 from a set bonus). 126 is enough to equip kingslayer, which gets you to 136, and Shako gets you the final 2.

Since you get 30 points in strength at character creation, you need just 76 points into strength, and 31 into dexterity, so for a bit over 100 stat points, you're done, and everything else can get dumped into vitality. My vitality may top off at around 400. Consider that I'll have a level 34 battle orders, and that's a freakin ton of life.

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Not to put too fine a point on it, but my barb at level 31, without echoing weapons and no where near maxing his Battle Orders, already has in excess of 700 life. He won't have gloam problems because he will be able to bask in the glory of their lightning bolts!

But that's not the point of this double post (or triple post at this point). I had another idea with this build. Death as the offhand weapon is ideal. It's definitely the heavy hitter of the two weapons, and the only thing it really lacks is IAS, which, because it's the offhand weapon, is irrelevant. So it's really the mainhand weapon that's the thing. And now I'm torn between two runewords for the mainhand. I had originally considered Kingslayer, but now I'm wondering if I'd be better off with Oath (also 4 sockets and works in axes, so it's no change from the original weapon plan).

For reference, here's a breakdown of the two Runewords:

Kingslayer - Mal-Um-Gul-Fal

+30% IAS
+230%-270% ed
-25% Target defense
+20% AR
33% CB
50% OW
+1 Vengence
+10 Strength
40% extra gold find

Oath - Shael-Pul-Mal-Lum (so similar in price too - Oath slightly cheaper)

30% ctc level 20 Bone Spirit on Striking
Indestructible
+50% IAS
+210%-340% ed
+75% damage vs. demons
+100 AR vs. demons
PMH
+10 Energy
10-15 magic absorb
Level 16 Heart of Wolverine (20 Charges)
Level 17 Iron Golem (14 Charges)

The biggest pros to using Kingslayer are the 33% CB, 50% OW, and the free Venegence skill that would allow me to forego Berserk as a PI solution. So the only way that it would make sense to use Oath is if I could get a whole heap of extra damage to make up for it. And I think I can.

First pro for Oath is that it comes with +50% IAS instead of +30% IAS. That actually makes a difference in a break point. So if I swing faster, that means more damage per second. Secondly, I'm probably going to have a slightly better +ed% on the Oath. The ed roles are variable on both weapons, and while a high roll on a Kingslayer would beat a low roll on an Oath, the average +ed% is a bit better for Oath (250% vs. 275%). But what I think may take Oath over the top is the ability to cast a level 16 Heart of Wolverine. At that level, you get a spirit that gives +125% ed (to both weapons), +130% AR, and 646 life (1,492 life after Battle Orders). It also gives the ability to cast an Iron Golem, although I'm assuming that I cannot have both an Iron and a Blood Golem simultaneously, and given my options, I'd rather have the Blood Golem for more life leech.

There's also a few other perks with Oath. The PMH mitigates the loss of OW to a degree, and +10-15 magic absorb is quite good. (Note that it's absorb, not magic damage reduction. The first 10-15 points of magic damage would actually heal, so it's the equivalent of having 20-30 magic damage reduction.) So I'm thinking that I need to spend two more skill points to pick up Berserk and go with Oath instead.

 

You know, the ctc level 20 Bone Spirit isn't bad either - at that level it averages about 400 magic damage, and so that's just added goodness with Berserk.

This character can potentially be a lot of fun. I have re-keyed my hot keys as there's only 5 skills I use with any frequency. I have used the keys A-S-D-F-G. A is Battle Cry, S is War Cry, D is Leap Attack, F is Double Swing, G is Taunt. I have the F1-F12 keys reserved for things that aren't cast mid-battle, like the BC, BO, Shout combo, and my summons will go on that line as well.

As far as mfing goes, most of my mf will come from my Shako. With all equipment and charms I'm looking at a number in the lowish 100s. No great shakes, but considerably better than my paladin. Barbarians also get a boost to mf by being able to use Find Item, which I'll have about a 50% chance of doing even with the investment of just one hard point. So not a great mf character but loads better than the paladin.

I really can't see how this build wouldn't work. If all goes as planned, I'll stun monsters for 7 full seconds (making defense largely irrelevant), have their defense lower dramatically, and be hitting for big damage with double swing. Here's my calculations on my weapons:

Death: Average damage per swing is 47.5. Bonuses include runeword (342% - that's the average roll), bash synergy (200%), axe mastery (100%), might merc (230%), HoW (125%), strength bonus (136%). That's right around 600, before we factor in CS, DS, or CB.

Oath - same thing except the runeword is 275% ed, and it's base average damage is 49, which also works out to nearly exactly 600. I swing 5 times per second (5fpa) so that 3,000 damage per second, without considering CB, DS, or CS, the Glaical Spike and Bone Spirits going off, and damage being done by the War Cry itself.

I also checked up on how WC affects Phsyical Immunes (which I saw as a potential problem if it didn't work) - turns out that they are immune to the damage dealt by WC as it does physical damage, but are affected just like everything else by the stun length. There is also no duration penalty on WC on Nightmare or Hell difficulty.

 

Doing barbarian builds is easier since you get a PI solution with just a couple of skill points (Berserk + prereqs) instead of having to think where you're going to muster enough elemental damage to whittle them down. Pallies don't have this luxury.

The unfortunate thing with Oath is that you either get a real bad-ass melee weapon by using an ethereal weapon for it OR get to use its really good charges as you play. You'd need to be literally swimming in ethereal 4-socket weapons and mid-level runes to be able to use both.

 

This is true. I'm going for option B.

 

I haven't played much, but I nearing a milestone for the character at level 39. That's when he gets to switch his weapons over to Butcher's Pupil and Headstriker, whcih should make Nightmare a breeze. The other equipment change is I'll switch the armor over to Silks of the Victor, as I'll lose my only source of mana leech when I make that switch. The next milestone after that is level 45 - that's when Raven Frost, echoing weapons, and my dual leech ring come online.

 

I plan my character out in phases. One slight downside is when you do that, sometimes you don't set the switch points quite right. I currently have my barbarian equipped with Rakescar and and Hellplague. That was the plan to go with them unitl I hit level 39, where both Butcher's Pupil and Headstriker come on line. The problem I'm running into is the slow killing speed that often happens when you near a switch point. (Actually I should rephrase that - I don't have super fast killing speed, which on normal, means slow killing speed.)

I probably should have planned a switch in between. Unfortunately, there's not much I can do about it now owing to character development. One pretty substantial problem of only sinking a few points into dexterity is it severly limits my choice of weapons. My dexterity is currently 52, and I don't plan on sinking any more points than that into it, so most exceptional swords are out of the question.

 

I do not possess any of the unique necro heads either. (Although I do have the set piece to the Trang-Oul set which is also quite good, especially if you throw on a couple extra pieces of it). So there's really four possible necro heads that could be of value.

Wait a second... Do you have the set piece? It gives +2 to the Bone and Poison tree - which is really the only one you should be much concerned with, has huge boost to blocking, +15 dex, +25 strength, and has big poison and fire resistance on it. If you aren't getting any +skills from your gloves, you could use that set piece too, and then you'd have +2 curses as well as some tasty partial set bonuses. You'll get a big boost to your mana recovery and a spammable level 18 Fireball to use against physical immunes.

(Now that I think about it, I don't know why I didn't put that on my poison necro. I'm already using the gloves, and if I added just one more piece I'd have +25% poison damage, and -25% enemy poison resistance, a fireball and fire wall skill...)

When I re-did my necro to be a poison-mancer, there were three things I wanted to get out of my shield:

1.) +2 skill to at least the bone and poison tree, preferably +2 all
2.) Increased chance to block
3.) Resistances

I ended up with a rare that had +2 all skills, +19% resistances, and 20% increased chance to block. I socketed it to up the resistances to +38% all. Of the set and unique heads, only the set piece and humonculus offer increased blocking, so you're limited to those two if you want to max out blocking.

If you don't care about blocking, then I would think that Darkforce Spawn (provided you get the +3 to the Bone and Poison tree) would be a better choice than Boneflame or any of the other unique heads owing to the 30% FCR on it. If your resistances are in the 50s with no resistance from your shield slot (and Anya's hell quest incomplete), the only thing you need to max your resistances is a pdiamond, meaning any shield you socket will do, and you wouldn't even have to spend an Um.

To me, that shield isn't end game material. The +2 skills can be found on a rare (which would have additional modifiers), especially when two of the three bonus skills are used rarely and never, respectively. If I was going to use a blue, I'd seek out a +3 B&P skull, with potentially other bonuses to that tree. I still think that the two set pieces may be your best option if you have them.

 

If you have both pieces, I think it's a no-brainer. I just looked up the specific stats on each item:

The +30% blocking is huge - definitely worth consideration of going max block. The gloves come with cold resistance, so you're getting 30%+ resistance to everything but lightning (and you could still add a pdiamond to the shield), and even more FCR - which is actually important for your character.

The partial set bonus of the increased mana recovery rate is also going to very useful, and a Level 18 Fireball for dealing with physical immunes is just gravy. (It would deal adequate damage of over 400 per hit assuming you have at least a point in Lower Resist along with some +skill items.) Granted a 400 point damage fireball isn't something that should be relied heavily upon in hell difficulty, but there are unbreakable physical immunes in hell, and for those specific situations, I'd think it would be adequate.

 

It is likely one of two pieces - either the helm or the belt. Those pieces are both in very high TCs, and represent the two pieces of elite equipment. (The armor, along with the other pieces is exceptional, so you likely already have them.) The helm is a giant skull, the elite version of the bone helm, and the belt is a troll belt, which is the elite version of the heavy belt (the larger of the three row belt types).

Perhaps. It would appear the only thing you're losing compared to what you currently have would be two less levels in your summoning skills. (Note: You could always keeping summoning specific gear in town in your stash for the purposes of summoning a golem in town. I assume you use the AoKL on switch for that, or possibly a +3 summoning wand with +skills to clay golem.) But you're also gaining quite a bit in resistances, mana recovery, strength, dexterity, and a shield where maxing blocking could be a consideration.

 

Gratz on that SOJ find. I'm still looking for my first as well.

 

I must have just got really lucky on my SoJ find. I found one quite a ways back on the realms, and I also found one quite quickly once I switched to single player - probably within a month of playing. Now I'm not saying that SOJs are common - heck, I haven't found another one since - and there are huge amounts of stuff I don't have. But I'm glad you finally landed your personal grail.

Everything barb related is progressing smoothly. I'm currently level 52, in Act II Nightmare. I have maxed Battle Orders, and I'm pretty close to maxing Bash. All of the skill points gained prior to level 24 that were not necessary for pre-requisites and one point wonders went into Bash, so it was already fairly well developed by the time I stared working on Battle Orders. I'd say I need at most a couple of more levels before I'm done.

If there is one point that I'm not thrilled about, it's that my resistances aren't so great - all are currently in the 40s. I'm not too concerned about it, because I know I have +65% resist all waiting for me when I reach level 62 and can equip the set. While I could equip three of the five set pieces right now, the set doesn't really shine unless you have all the pieces, and the only two pieces you'd consider wearing individually are the two pieces that have level requirements in the 60s - the gloves and the belt. So I should see a big increase once I hit that level.

Basically, everything goes on once I hit level 63. Not just the set, but the two weapons as well. I need the set equipped to meet the strength and dexterity minimums of my weapons, and so I'll do everything at once. (While the weapons have runeword requirements of 49 and 55, but the base weapons have level requirements higher than that anyway, and I wouldn't be able to use them until level 61 anyway - so a whole two levels where I could have had them, but won't.)

After that it's War Cry. I'm pleased to report that there does not appear to be any duration reduction for WC once you proceed into Nightmare (and presumably hell). I actually think I will be able to Stun stuff for a full 7-8 seconds once I max the skill. Since I am not going ot invest heavily into dexterity, and I won't get much of a bonus to attack rating from my skills, I think I will have to make gratuitous use of Battle Cry and War Cry during hell difficulty. My kill speed might not be great, but the monsters kill speed won't be either.

The remaining points will go into axe mastery, and I should be working on that starting in late nightmare. It's unlikely that I'll max it out - unless I level into the low 90s, but I'm working on the Mastery only because there's nothing else that will benefit my character in any meaningful way. I expect that his mf abilities won't be great - not paladin bad mind you - but nothing to write home about. I'm guessing somewhere between 100-150 once I have everything equipped.

EDIT: Sorry the gloves-belt combo didn't work out as well as I had hoped. I did concede in the early going that that particular combination makes the most sense if you wanted both max blocking and max resistances. The increased mana, mana recovery, and FCR I thought would be good to have in order to make bone spear more spammable.

AFAIK, there is no cool-down timer on BSpear, so the only limiting factor in how fast you can cast them is the time of the animation, so getting some FCR makes a lot of sense. If your primary skill has no cooldown timer, than FCR for a caster is what IAS is for a melee fighter.

Reducing the casting animation by a few frames is just like reducing the number of frames between hits - again, that's assuming you don't have a cool down period on your spells. For example, FCR isn't a priority for a Meteorb, as two of the three main spells she has are timered, and the timer is the limiting factor in how fast she can cast them. But for bone spear - and for your lightning sorceress - FCR will be key in maximizing your damage.

I looked up some FCR tables, and it would appear that the last attainable breakpoint for casting BSpear is at 88%. The last one is all the way up to 126%, and that looks pretty hard to get to without some major gear concessions.

 

The IAS = FCR comparison is fair in theory but not completely valid. While you can't really get much direct melee damage bonus from items (War Travelers is the only notable item here and that's rather minor still), there's a legion of items that give +skills, which is direct +damage for spells in most cases, often exponentially so once you break into the slvl 28+ range.

Granted, many high end caster items give both FCR and +skills but you're in for a world of headache trying to maximize both with medium-level gear.

Also, there is this thing called mana that still manages to put restraint on some character builds without a boatload of FCR to add insult to injury.

 

Definitely - if given a choice between more +skills and more FCR, more +skills is almost always the way to go. The suggestion of gloves was because there's really no items out there for a necro that give much in the way of +skills, but the gloves give FCR and +2 curses. But generally I agree, FCR should be a secondary consideration once you get your skills up as high as you can.

In sadder news, it appears that there was one error in my DS barb calculation. While it certainly doesn't break the build, it does reduce the overall impressiveness of it. Apparently, you lose any of your summons you get from weapons (in my case, HoW, and either a Blood or Iron Golem), when you weapon switch. As I will be weapon switch every few minutes to renew my war cries, that's a major bummer, as it basically means I cannot keep my summons at all.