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F/T or F/M/T?

Discussion in 'BG2: Throne of Bhaal (Classic)' started by Mongerman, Apr 26, 2009.

  1. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    Actually, I usually give my F/T Carsomyr the whole time. That's mainly because I'm not a huge fan of backstabbing, though. I know it's powerful, but it just takes too much figiting around for my preference. I've tried it, and it kicked everything, especially with the Celestial Katana, but I felt uncomfortable in every fight. Plus, I don't think you can backstab many of the things you really want to (adamantine golems, liches, dragons, many bosses).

    Carsomyr does enough dmg for me to be happy, and it gives my F/M/T the ability to be effective against mages in timestop, something no other weapon/ability I've ever found could do. The spellcasting failure is nice, especially if it works on clerics, but it still won't get past Chain Contengiency, which just about every mage enemy in the game has loaded with Immunity to Magical Weapons, Mantle, Improved Mantle, and/or Stoneskin.
     
  2. Proteus_za

    Proteus_za

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    I usually backstab liches and mages - liches are vulnerable to backstab, as are mindflayers. Beholders, dragons and golems are not though.

    When you backstab right, it can remove a potentially dangerous element from the fight in one shot.
     
  3. Fly2tHeSkY

    Fly2tHeSkY Southern Comfort Veteran

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    I thought most liches saw through invisibility??
     
  4. Proteus_za

    Proteus_za

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    I dont know, maybe thats a P&P thing. In BG2, even with SCS2, I can have my thief run behind the Lich and backstab him before his protections come up. Its a cheesy way of winning admittedly, but it works. Notably I do it to the Lich in the underdark and some of the liches needed for the kangaxx quest (since its easy to find out where they will appear).
     
  5. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    Kangaxx sees through invisibility, and the Lich in the underdark does, too (though if you move fast you can get him before he acts, and I guess somehow it still counts as a backstab?), but most liches can't. It's been a while since I played and, like I said, I only did backstabbing once, so I don't remember that so well, but I didn't think you could backstab any undead.
     
  6. Proteus_za

    Proteus_za

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    I pause the game to get them before they can react! Perhaps their immunity kicks in via script. For the lich in the underdark, I do it before he has even appeared. Yes, its supremely cheesy I know, but sometimes I really dont feel like fighting liches. When I do fight them fair and square (which SCSII often forces you to), I like using False Dawn and Sunray. And the Mace of Disruption when their spell protections are down.

    Sunray has to be one of my favourite spells.
     
  7. Sir Rechet

    Sir Rechet I speak maths and logic, not stupid Veteran

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    It's also worth to note that past the initial 9 or 10 levels, a single class thief actually improves in THAC0 faster than f/m/t does. 440k vs 750k exp per +1 bonus to hit. Even f/t only improves every 500k.

    For this to really matter, though, you'd need to install a mod that allows THAC0 improvements past level 20...
     
  8. saros Gems: 5/31
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    I think that SCSII can be cheesed with a F/T and maybe not in a no-reload attempt. However, in IA, a F/T wouldn't last very long all by himself. Important scrolls are too scarce, and the most powerful items cannot be used with UAI (besides, the most powerful items would benefit mostly a M/T class combination if they were usable with UAI).

    For IA 5.0., I'd say that it is soloable in a no-reload by a F/M multiclass (but not dualclass unless huge experience exploits are applied to get both fighter and mage HLAs), even easier with a F/I and a F/M/T, and probably possible with a F/M/C (I have a current run). Maybe it is soloable with a Blade as well, but definitely not in a no-reload (requires a LOT of reloading in the final battle).

    I've soloed a Wizard Slayer through Ascension with relatively few reloads. Indeed, the number of hits is what counts, not to mention that wizard slayer spellcasting penalty wears off in a couple of rounds (meaning, a WS has to continue hitting his spellcaster victim in order to ensure no spellcasting). Since reading scrolls, using wands, shooting Contingencies and Sequencers does not count as 'spell casting', and especially in difficulty increasing mods there are a lot of enemies Forcecasting spells, I wouldn't rely too much on a WS.

    2-handed weapons are useful with GWW attacks...and that's about it. Otherwise, sticking to dual-wield (preferably Improved Hasted) with Belm or Kundane off-hand is the best combination for a fighter.
     
  9. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    Saros, the beautiful thing about BG2 is that single handed weapons and two-handed weapons are very well balanced. Yes, two weapons is better for a WS due to higher attack rate, but aside from that class, it's really a toss-up. Weapons like Ixil's Spear, Carsomyr, Staff of the Magi, Soul Reaver, and others have not only wonderful damage by themselves, but also bonuses that are often competitive with Crom Feyr, Axe of the Unyielding, etc. They gain an even higher advantage in parties with multiple tanks, where these weapons' longer range allows them to attack even when another tank or two holds a choke-point.

    This is why I love BG2, so many builds and options are viable! Ranged weapons can slaughter everything. Two-handed weapons can shatter the toughest foes. Dual-wielding turns you into a quizanart. Oh, and don't forget the spells. All the spells. I think shields are rather weak, but that's it.
     
  10. Sir Rechet

    Sir Rechet I speak maths and logic, not stupid Veteran

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    Depends on what you mean by 'weak' when addressing shields, but sometimes that extra 4 or 5 bonus to your AC drops the enemy's chance to hit you from 30% to a mere 5%. Optimal case, of course, and pretty much a non-issue in ToB.

    Considering that BG saga doesn't really make you fight huge hordes of monsters all that often - compared to Icewind Dale 2 at least - the old truth about a good offense being the best defense pretty much still holds.
     
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