Medieval 2: Total War

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Taking a break myself to rethink my tactics. I know the other Catholic factions will treat you like crap, and the Pope won't let you kill them...

England is not as easy to play as you'd think...

 

Ugh, I can't get the mod to work that fixes ballista towers. I thought I followed the instuctions correctly, but the last step, where I go and try to change the exe portion to bat in the desktop shortcut, it says the path I have selected is invalid. Obviously, it means that I have something in the wrong folder, but I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. The first file is in the data folder, and the other is in the main folder.

In my current game I'm a little concerned. The Pope just called a crusade, which is fine, but the downside is that I just got a jihad called against me. I've never tried to defend against a jihad, but I'm thinking it cannot be fun. I also have the joy of dealing with the Black Death in all of my cities. It's going to be double the fun dealing with the jihad seeing as how I'm going to lose about 10% of my garrison every turn.

[ February 05, 2007, 17:37: Message edited by: Aldeth the Foppish Idiot ]

 

Ive had a Jihad called against me just after i took Jerusalem, its not fun. Lucky i had one full stack in Jerusalem and managed to scrape together another Full stack to reinforce Jerusalem after ever assault. Its lucky i had the 2nd army, as the turks came at me with 3 full stacks, one of mainly proper troops, and the other 2 mainly of cheap Jihad only units. The army was able to crush the 2 lesser Full stacks and the City held off the main army. But before i could reinforce the city after the first siege, the Egyptians came at me with a Full stack, so i attacked that army when they sieged the city, and crushed them between 2 Half stacks. Turky then came at me with the half stack, but nothing serious, and then cos the moors took so long coming, the Jihad got cancelled. Egypt gave up after i killed their 4th Family member, Turkey lost 6

 

I don't know boys, I think the charm has worn off for me. I still have yet to complete my English campaign, and I don't see myself ever getting it done.

School/stocks/guitar/chess...

Where is a man supposed to fit into that tight schedule a conquering of the world? Woe is me...

 

@Aldeth: That sounds curious. You simply changed the path from blah\blah\medieval2.exe to blah\blah\medieval2.bat? Because that should've worked. Maybe you made a typo in the shortcut link, or in the .bat file itself?

My kingdom came through some hard times. First, I was assaulted for several turns by almost all of my enemies (which are many: Egypt, Turkey, HRE, Milan and Moors, of which only the Moors didn't attack). Every turn for about 5-6 turns I would have at least 1 or 2 settlements besieged. Since the computer seems to love weak armies with lots of militia units, routing them was fairly easy, and I could usually do that with a simple sally. Then I struck back. I eliminated the Milanese by assassinating the last of its family members, beat back the Egyptians by taking Cairo, and for good measure took the nearest Turkish settlement too (which happened to be Edessa).

Then came along the Mongols. Which made me realise two things: First, I need to tone down on the huge stack size, my computer is having difficulties with two full stack armies (totalling about 5000 men) attacking my slightly more than half stack army in a well defended city. The fact that after the first army was defeated another army showed up (yet another full stack army) didn't help either.

Second, if I had discovered where they would've shown up and which route they took (going north from Bagdad to Mosul) in advance, I could easily have sent my spy + assassin and have eliminated the Mongol faction within the 10 or so turns it took them to show up.

As to repelling the Mongols, I must admit that I shamelessly used the new-found knowledge of how to make ballista towers act as cannon towers and watched their armies be turned into so much minch-meat with extraordinary amounts of glee. I simply do not have the patience to lose several cities while I slowly wear the Mongols down.

On the non-cheating side, I decided it was time to do something about those treacherous HRE bastards. So, I set out to build a rather elite army (I actually got the swordsman guild in Palermo) to crush their resistance at Bologna. I was always a little reticent about this, because it was always defended by at least two full stack armies. Only, those armies had not changed in composition since the beginning of the game.

Along came my half stack army. It could conveniently attack a mere two stack army of town militia, drawing out their full stack army garrisoning Bologna as reinforcements. It's interesting how utterly devastating cavalry is in the open field. After sweeping away the two stack army, I turned to their reinforcements. I waited, sent in the cavalry as their missile units approached (they even came foolishly running ahead of the rest of their army). Needless to say, 4 units of cavalry can rout 4 units of crossbow militia and peasant archers rather easily. Then came the rest of their army. Again: wait, rush, watch them rout.

At the end of the day, their garrison was completely annihilated, leaving the city to me. Then, in the same turn, I attacked the other full stack HRE army, posted on the other side of the city. Same story as above, leaving me with three very impressive gold striped cavalry units, fully upgraded with armor and weapons to boot, and one similarly impressive General's bodyguard. And leaving the HRE army minus roughly 5000 units.

 

I went out and bought the complete Total Wars set tonight. I am going to read the manual first and hopefully get started tomorrow night. I guess I will start with playing England based on what I have read here.

Edit: I started playing and while I got off to a good start I seem to be a bit bogged down now. I gobbled up the rebel settlements so that I was up to eight settlements but then I tried to conquer Scotland and the pope told me to cut it out. The Scots are blocking me from getting to Dublin so I am attacking the French - hopefully the pope won't get on my case for this too.

[ February 06, 2007, 21:39: Message edited by: JSBB ]

 

The pope gets on your case for any aggression against other catholic factions. The Scots only have one city you need to blitz it and to get to Dublin you can build boats! Anyway, if you read this thread you should know that easy does it. Do not over stretch yourself, build up your economy and hten make your carefully planned moves. I find this both more succesful and more enjoyable and it enables you to experience more aspects of the game than just siege after siege with shoddy units. I usually dnot play to win as the main goal but to win while enjoying it the best and I like to build up a core and absord a territory or two every ten turns or so.

 

The economy is one thing I am not having any problems with - thanks to everything I have read here my economy is very strong. I also seem to have considerably higher developed troops than the computer so far which has certainly helped.

I ended up taking out Angers before the pope told me to stop picking on the poor froggies. That was good enough really because it gave me access to Bordeaux which was rebel held. The Scots decided to chase me back to York so I am going to wipe their army out and with their army out of the way I should have a clean run at Dublin.

 

Well, I was able to annex Angers while France was Excommunicated, and whent eh pope died, France was willing to accept a CF. The HRE did try to relieve me of Antwerp, but when i moved an army towards Antwerp, the cowards backed off and paid 500 florins for a CF.

I have strike forces ready to move on the next fool that tries something, but must be careful, the new Pope is from France...

 

Well, I doubt that there was a typo in the shortcut link - that shortcut is automatically set up by the game. The only thing I was doing was changing exe to bat. However, I suppose that there may be a typo in the bat file. I copied and pasted it directly from your insturction as follows:

However, now that I'm looking at it, is there supposed to be a space in there? Or as another option, was the "--" in that line supposed to be something besides "--"? I copied it literally. Now that I'm looking at it, perhaps you meant that the -- meant you were leaving something else out. Was I supposed to put the exact line from the shortcut file into that line? Other times, when you were indicating that you were leaving the full line out you used elipses (...) to indicate that the full line wasn't there. I'm a total newb at this, so it's more than possible that I did something stupid.

Well, the thing is, it's not hard to have a strong ecomony, it's just that there are many mistakes you can make early and screw it up. I know I thought it was a good idea to buy some mercenary units early in the game to help me out with some early assaults. Little did I know that purchasing mercenary units early in the game is a poor long-term solution to military planning. I will add one further word of caution. The middle part of the game is the easiest part in terms of dealing with your economy. It gets tricky again later on when several of your cities have grown to large sizes and you're starting to purchase improvements that cost several thousand florins to produce. You certainly want those buildings, but by the time you hit the year 1400 or so, there are going to be a ton of cities that need those improvements. I usually shoot to have about 200,000 florins saved up by the early 1300s to start paying for these high cost improvements.

I mostly concur with that strategy. Slow, measured expansion is usually better than rapid expansion with one noteworthy exception: early in the game. Regardless of what faction you are playing, there are usually several nearby rebel towns that don't belong to anyone - yet. Depending on which faction you are playing, the number is variable, but there are almost always one or two rebel settlements bordering your territory. If you are playing a central or eastern European faction, chances are there are several nearby options.

Over the first 20 or so turns of the game, all of your neighbors are going to make a push to lay claim to as many of the rebel settlments as possible, and it behooves you to do the same. The rebel settlements are going to fall - the only question being whether they are going to fall to your army or someone else's army. If you skip out on taking those rebel settlements within your reach, it usually means that you are going to have to take them later when they are garrisoned by better troops from a rival faction. In the early going the only battles I have are with rebels. I never even consider starting a war with another faction if there are still rebel settlements to be had.

In all honestly, 500 florins isn't a heck of a lot. Granted it's better than nothing, but if I want a cease fire I usually do not worry too much about what the opponent is willing to pay for it. It's never much, and it rarely is even the cost of a single building. Typically, they only offer an amount that will pay for an agent.

My current game is very strange. I'm in a war with the HRE, and they have sent several diplomats over to ask me to become a vassal. I am currently the largest faction in the game (HRE is the second largest). I have no idea how the game handles vassalage, but I imagine becoming a vassal is not a good path to success. Plus, with my understanding of how vassalage worked historically, it was typically the SMALLER faction that become the vassal. Anyone give me an explanation of what becoming a vassal entails? What are the benefits/penalties for the two factions?

With the possible exception of the Milanese, the HRE is probably the worst neighbor to have. The Pope is from the HRE as well, so that isn't helping matters either. They attacked me first, but then when I counterattacked, the Pope threatened to excommunicate me. You'd think that the one who did the provoking would be the one that would be threatened with excommunication. I am only responding in kind to the HRE's advance. That having been said, there's only one turn left where I have to play nice, and the HRE just moved a full stack army into one of my territories. My largest army is just one move away, so a battle is imminent. Fortunately, when the Pope threatens you with excommunication, it only applies to attacking units in the other faction's territory. If an enemy unit enters YOUR territory, you can attack it without penalty. (The same goes for ships that are blockading your ports - you can attack them without being excommunicated as well.)

[ February 07, 2007, 15:36: Message edited by: Aldeth the Foppish Idiot ]

 

Well, it certainly looks like you did everything right, so don't be too hard on yourself. It should work. There's probably something very obvious wrong, and we're just missing it.

Just for reference: Your executable is named medieval2.exe, and not something else? Similarly, the .bat file is named medieval2.bat? That's the only thing I can think of that could be wrong. Alternatively, you could try to start the game by double clicking directly on the medieval2.bat file. If that works normally then we can deduce there must be something wrong in the path in your shortcut link.

I agree. Early on, it is a good idea to expand rapidly. I tried to take it slow in the beginning once (twice actually, come to think of it), but in the end, as your cities begin to grow, you'll find that your income per turn is insufficient to keep up with the rising price of structures.

In fact, this is usually a recurring theme throughout a single game. First, I expand rapidly, then I consolidate, and after a while I take over a couple of cities in rapid succession (or even in the same turn), then consolidate and retrain my armies again.

The HRE seem very fond of others becoming their vassals. They've offered me the same. Naturally, I declined. Now, I've never tried this, but I would guess that as a vassal, you would be guaranteed to not be attacked by your master (the HRE in this case), while perhaps paying a tribute every turn for this favor. As to why you would ever want to become a vassal, especially if you're superior to the faction offering the vassalage, is beyond me.

 

I just thought of a possibility. I think that I just named the file medieval2.bat. I don't think I did "Save As" .bat file. That might be it.

Well, I may not be superior militarily - at least not yet - that might change after the upcoming battle. I did get a message saying that I am the largest faction, but that just means that I control more settlements than everyone else. I does not necessarily mean that I have the largest army (in fact, since I never saw a message indicating that I'm the most powerful, I have a feeling that I don't have the largest army).

Your take on vassalage sounds reasonable. Surprisingly, vassalage is not something that is covered in any detail in either the game manual or the strategy guide.

 

I dont get vassalage either. In my game as Portugal i had eliminated the Moors and taken both Zaragoza and Valencia, so only had Spain to go, then Milan started na war with me as they had taken both of Frances southern territories, they attacked me with a full stack that i knew i couldnt fend off, so when they offered for me to become as vassal is said yes. They then took away their army, but a few turns later returned and attacked me again, even tho i was their vassal.

So i dont know what being a vassal does, it doesnt seem to affect anything.

 

I just realized that the HRE is not my main rival, but rather the Venetians. Somehow, someway, they got HUGE. I sent a diplomat to talk to the Milanese to see if I could get them to attack the HRE as well (we're allies) and it was them that actually got me drug into the war with the HRE in the first place. In typical AI fashion, after dragging me into a war, the Milanese go and sign a cease fire with the HRE. Anyway, diplomat went to Milan - Venetian. Then he went to Dijon - Venetian. Then to Marsailles - Venetian. Zagreb, Florence and Vienna are also Venetian. I eventually traded maps with the Venetians, and it turns out that they own the entire southern tier of Europe (with the exception of the Papal States and the Sicilians, but they have all of three cities between them).

I still haven't found where the remaining Milanese are, but it makes sense that they signed a peace treaty - they probably only have a settlment or two left! That's the problem with agressive factions - they gamble a lot, and sometimes when you gamble, you lose.

 

Playing my game of Danes, even though I lost to Englandl, a faction I have only encountered by sea. Still, in a good spot so it's worth continuing. Captured Jerusalem in 1150 in a Crusade. I knew I was into a world of pain, but I would've been excommunicated if I didn't join it.

Held it against the Egyptians for a long time, until the Mongols arrived. Then, they started to throw their men at me. If I calculated correctly, I've killed over 20000 Mongols, although some by capture. They continued to keep me under semi-constant siege until the Tirumids arrived. I grabbed the opportunity and had a crusade on Acre called and took it the same turn. One turn later and both cities had full garrisons, 20 in each.

Then the Tirumids came. They took Antioch, the Mongols' capital, but was soon thrown out by rebels. They tried to take Acre with 3 20+ stacks, including elephants, but I held them off and got their leader killed, disorganizing them greatly. As a result, they sent four 20+ stacks at Jerusalem, who didn't have any experienced guard. I managed to fight the first battle to a stalemate, loosing allo but a fourth of my army, but I sold everything sellable the next turn because I knew I'd loose.

They came with heavy bombards and artillery elephants and soon it was over. I DID have a 8-1 killcount though.

In the meantime, I only hold eight areas in Europe(Århus, Stockholm, Oslo, Hamburg, Marieburg, Stettin, Helsingfors, and Beufel or whatever it's named.). Russia doesn't dare to attack me even though we're at war but the HRE keep sending armies consisting of peasants and milita, something my gunpowder and heavy cavalry units have no problem defeating.

So, now I'm in Acre and biding my time until I can take back Jerusalem and awaiting for my fleet to arrive in America.

 

Great game or what!

 

Oh man, you're a braver man than me Register. Bad enough fighting the Mongols, but if you're putting up with the Mongols and Timurids simultaneously, that's worlds of problems. On the bright side, sometimes the Timurids and Mongols fight each other. That's always good times

 

I just had a great win as Egypt. I had just finished fending off the a full stack of crusaders from Venice, when another full stack arrived from Denmark. In Jerusalem is had Ballista Towers (Cannon Towers ) 6 units of Saracen Militia, 2 Units of Spear Militia, 2 Arab Cavalry, a General, 6 Desert Archers and 3 Kurdish Javelins. Unfortunatley the ram survived and reached my gate, although i did take down one siege tower. The Danish annihilated my melee units at the gate, and my cavalry. I had kept my general out of the fray. At this point i thought i was screwed, cos the Danish were rushing onto my walls to get my archers, but i noticed a stray cavalry figure (had it on ultra low graphics cos my pc cant handel it) So i charged it with my general. Lo and behold, it was THEIR general, and swiftly got impaled upon my lances. At this point i knew the only way to win was Rout all his units. So i just kept charging my general in, pulling out then re-charging, until i finally got a couple units routing, which when coupled with copious fire arrows got a huge chain reaction which routed the whole Danish army, which at this point out-numbered me 4-1 So, Jerusalem survives for another day, and the Crusade has now ended

 

I seem to be doing fairly well at everything except managing to keep the pope happy. I managed to get one of my cardinals elected as pope and even he ended up despising me pretty quickly. I have almost eliminated France - I just have to get some of my cavalry units back up to full strength before I go after Marseille.

After that I should probably pay some more attention to Milan. They are number two in military might right now (after me) and they sneak attacked me at Rheims. I recaptured Rheims but I am thinking that inflicting some punative damages would be good.

Edit: I took out Marseilles and then the Scots which triggered victory given that I was playing the short campaign. I was a little surprised to see that I unlocked so many other factions - I only expected to unlock the ones I actually defeated.

I am not sure yet whether I am going to start a fresh campaign or continue on playing my current one. Milan just got excommunicated and they have been annoying me with their repeated attacks on Rheims and Paris. I have a pretty large army ready in both Rheims and Paris so I may continue playing long enough to eliminate Milan.

[ February 11, 2007, 21:42: Message edited by: JSBB ]

 

The Timurids are mean ass gits. I can't believe they just did this... in my current England game, they moved every single army they have into my lands before they started taking settlements. That's Eastern Europe. Usually they will target Russia, or move south to Turkey before moving into Poland/Hungary. They seemed to come straight for me! This means I'm currently at war with Spain whilst trying to Iberian peninsula, Sicily who invaded my Northern Italy holdings, the Polish who continue to be an annoyance, and now the Timurids who invaded my new holdings in eastern Europe. Not only am I at war with several factions at once, they happen to be on every side of my empire. Pretty tricky keeping each front loaded with enough men, but bloody great fun. Damn Timurids, I wasn't expecting that!! Unexpected things make this game more fun .