POLL: A D&D poll

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I don't call that powergaming, that's just playing D&D. Of course you want to pick the best things for your PC, but actually think about *it* some and enjoy the game it self rather than be a greedy level pig.

 

"A greedy level pig"?

Hilarious. I hate people who don't put some thought into their characters. The whole essence of D&D is the story! That's why we relax, tell some really good jokes, laugh our bums off when some poor fool rolls a critical miss, and just have fun with the whole deal.

 

It was meant to be funny, that's why I posted it.

 

There's a "New" Mexico??
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Gotta Love Montgomery Burns!

 

I suppose they couldn't think of anything else, lame ass if you ask me.

 

I agree with joacqin a bit. Roleplaying doesn't exclude powergaming and vice versa - of course to some degree.

Min-maxing stats is not what I like and taking single levels for bonuses isn't what I like either. The thing is that what the character could himself choose for even the sole purpose of growing in power is more or less OK, but what the munchkin running him spends whole nights on counting up is just lame.

So, Joe Fighter wasn't really the smartest guy in his class. INT 8. He's not particularly stupid, but doesn't really fit for a counsellor if you catch my drift. WIS 10. Charisma? Well, he has always been handsome, but isn't a born leader as a matter of fact. CHA 12-13. And the rest goes to STR, DEX and CON. However, some people tend to give Joe Fighter INT, WIS and CHA in the range 4-6 and expect him to get good prices, solve puzzles, elicit information from people, think up battle tactics, chat up ladies, lead soldiers and so on and so forth. *That* is real munchkinism.

A roleplayer could run such a min-maxed character, of course, but he would pay some attention to the obvious impair... ekhm... challenges of his character.

Similarly nothing is wrong with a moderately ugly priest who's rather strong than intelligent, feels best in melee and rallies dwarven berserkers to the floor. Of course if he has a good storyline.

If I showed you my IWD2 paladin/wizard of Mystra that BTW is completely legitimate in pnp, you would then even more quickly see what I'm talking about. His stats are: STR 14 DEX 10 CON 10 INT 20 (16 at start) WIS 14 CHA 16. Will anyone call these powergaming stats? But, given his good INT and decent WIS he gets quite a few bonus spells and given his diviner subclass he's able to amass a decent amount of slots. Now: bull's strength (paladin), draw upon holy might (paladin), holy power (paladin), shield (diviner), stoneskin (diviner), mirror image (diviner), haste (diviner), blink (diviner). See? But what have I really done? Just chosen some spells. I could also add luck (diviner), cat's grace (diviner), fire shield (diviner), but I don't have the patience to stay casting for so long and I don't especially need to - I'm already hitting 30 AC, have more attacks than a fighter, deliver cosmic damage and I'm completely untouchable for practically anything unless someone lives long enough to dispel my precious power-up construction (note that I can attempt do disintegrate the overly active casting boy with transmution focus and resistance penetration feats). Then I pray and I pray hard

I doubt there's much of munchkin builds that would beat this at first glance crippled paladin. Even if you enrich you barbarian by evasion from rogue levels, weapon specialisation from warrior levels and free dual-wielding from ranger levels. Or take a paladin/monk/sorcerer combo. Or any other killing machine deprived of soul, brain and cojones

 

Chev, what is the level balance of that pally/wiz of yours?

 

Fifty fifty.

 

Hack&slash is a necessary evil, nothin' but a plot tool. The roleplayin' element is so much more important.

 

I'd like to respond to two points made here. To start with no two PC should have the same goals. To say that all your character have the same exact goal 'to get tougher' is extremely short sighted. In a true role-playing game each character should be different, just as all people in the real world are different. To say otherwise is to create flat unrealistic character with little life and no meaning.

The seoncd points is that 'Doing the best for my character is not powergaming'. This is not totally true. A true role-player designs and develops his character based on the idea not the numbers. If you say 'I'll never take a spell, skill, or feat that I will not use to it's fullest' you are powergaming to a degree. I character should follow his character idea. If the character has an interest in a certain skill, spell, etc. but you as the player know it may not help him by more powerful and you take it never-the-less you are role-playing.
A few examples my ranger has skill points in craft cooking. This may never help him in play but is part of his character idea. My Cleric of Pelor has craft (glass cutting) so he can make stained glass icon for his god. His may never help in combat but make the character more interesting.

I'd say that is the key concept. Role-players do things to make their character interesting and unique. Powergamers do things to make their character stronger and tougher. I don't care what my stats are. I don't care what items I own. I don't care what level I am. I'm not playing to win. It about the experience of playing. You never win or lose so why try? You're just trying to enjoy the interaction with other in a unique and imaginative setting.

Many people who play RPGs have some powergaming behavior. The key is to not let the behavior become the central theme of the game. It's a story. The number are only there to help the DM and the players tell the story. Players who get hung up to much in the detial trying to affect the story maybe just too imature.

 

I am in total agreement with Voltric here. Also I think it depends a lot on the DM. A good DM makes it so that power-gaming isn't at all the point and ensures that there are too many riddles and puzzles to be solved. For instance, if you're in a dungeon, when you have lots of monsters but very few puzzles or traps then it becomes hack-and-slash. But if you have lots of strange quests (like a moving painting that when you touch it, comes real) then it's much more role-playing and hardly any hack-and-slash at all. And if you have really BIZAIRRE traps then it requires the players to think more and gives more chances for role-playing.

However unlike many people here, I personally think that if your character has more personality and interesting traits, then it actually becomes stronger -- not just more fun. But then once again, this comes back to the DM. For instance I once played a cat-trainer mage -- I had a side-job of training cats for circuses. This opened up the way for all sorts of extra quests just involving me and my crazy cats so I was able to get even more experience than my other party members and level up faster. But as I said before, you might need a cool DM.