Prince Harry - Idiot

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Morgoth, personally I feel it's ok to dress up as nazi if the occation calls for it (i.e a costume ball with a military uniform theme) but as I remember reading an article about it, the theme of the party was colonial/native and I really don't understand what Nazis have to do with that. Besides he had to know his costume would draw attention.

As for the outrage. I would assume that wearing the dress of a spanish conquisador would be an outrage amongst the native Americans such as the nazi costume is an outrage in Britain.

 

Are you bloody serious? Do you actually know what the Swastika represents?

 

Quite a lot actually. It was used by the Finnish airforce (before the rise of the nazis in Germany) and I believe it has something to do with religions in India too. It is a shame that the symbol has been tamished so that everywhere people see one they can only think of nazis.

 

Morgoroth - you do know that the Nazi swastika is a mirror image of the Hindu swastika?

Either way, prince Harry is a public person and a major. He should behave like the two. If he doesn't like the constraints - let him leave the royal family (I think there is a procedure to renounce the royal name in such an occassion), they'll be better off, and his family will be better off.

Oh sure, he's young. But I'm young, too, and I never conduct in such a fashion. I might be aiming for an academic post in the future, and I know that such past might carry an effect. If Harry is too stupid to recognise that, he's unfit to rule, regardless of how such reign is limited - that's even worse - if he could ever have absolute power, he wouldn't care about the public opinion. Since he never will, he should behave like the people that pay for him* expect him to.
*) I know the royal family has enough private property (Queen Elizabeth II, as head of the family, is listed on the Forbes's Billionaires 100, with ca. $5 thousand million in holdings) to live off it even if they are forced to abdicate, but currently they are still supported by tax money.

 

I used to feel a bit sorry for him - the pressure of being under public scrutiny all the time. And when he got in a bit of trouble, well, I just chalked all the publicity up to the ridiculous obsession some people have over a completely out-of-touch, irrelevant and inconsequential "Royal" Family that has long out-lived its purpose.

This behaviour, however, is something different. All the more support for getting rid of the whole bunch of them.

 

@Barmy, as in the symbol for the regime that cost the lives of millions?

Is that your problem? The deportation and genocide of millions?

Sooooo, I guess when he came in a Chinese Communist outfit then he would be lynched right? No, because Germany is a lot closer than China(even though Mao murdered a lot more than Hitler), a genocide at a great distance is like 'Genocide? Oh, how terrible, well live goes on right?'.
If I told you that Turkey murdered over 2/3rd of a nation out and never apologized, would you gasp of horror when Prince whatishisname wore a Turkish Army uniform at a party? Would you?

Or is it because Germany deported and murdered millions of people AND Germany fought against England?
Well that makes it so much worse, doesn't it?

 

You're damn right it does.
You just simply do NOT go to a party dressed as a Nazi. Especially if you're someone in the public eye. It's just stupity in the extreme and is bound to offend tons of people. There is no contesting the point.

I don't care about China or Turkey, because that is not how Harry dressed. If he did go dressed like that, then there probably wouldn't have been as much uproar, simply because we never had much interaction with these and they don't get much coverage in the media. Although I would still expect a certain amount of moan.

However, that should not detract from this idiocy. Thousands and thousands of people died for this country in that war and he has just shat on them.

 

Yes I agree with you on that, as an important figure he should have known better.

Edit:

That he should have known better doesn't makes it his fault, chosing to be ignorant of something makes as much sense as chosing what to believe.

[ January 16, 2005, 18:46: Message edited by: Morgoth ]

 

Reasons? As it often is, public ignorance:
Ideology:
Nazism, Communism, or Imperialism for that matter, are sick ideologies. There's no contesting that.
Responsibility:
All are responsible for killing multitude of people.
Public knowledge:
Most people (in UK, at least) are taught about Nazism (it is involved with history of Britain), but not about Imperialism (far past), or Communism (far away). So whilst Communism is responsible for more murders than Nazism (in both relative and absolute numbers), and Imperialism in relative numbers, Nazism has arisen to be a symbol of evil, whilst neither Communism nor Imperialism have.

That, I think, explains it, because here in Poland, students at school are taught about both Hitler's Third Reich and Stalin's Soviet Union, and they are able to recognise both as evil.

One think is true about Communism, however - it had better propaganda and better artistry - whilst Nazism relied on older symbols (thus forever tainting the name of some of the most talented composers - Bach, Wagner, R. Strauss, to name but a few - writers, and painters as well), Communism aimed to create their own. This is reflected in today's designer apparel - people in the West tend to accept clothes with Soviet symbols, but here in Poland, most would be appalled.

(As a side note - if I was to be anti-Semitic, an interesting point comes up - Nazism is responsible for death of Jews, whilst neither Communism nor Imperialism seemed to be interested in judicide... Quite a conspiracy theory can be woven from that...)

 

chev -- it took about a day. I think what he did was pretty tasteless and shined a rather bright light not only on his stupidity, but his brother's as well. Can you even imagine the Royal Family's initial reaction in private?

 

For those of you who think it isn't such a big deal to show up on parties in a nazi uniform, you should give it a try in my neighbourhood, i give you about 30 seconds before the lynchmob gets you.

 

Just 30 seconds, I'd expect 5 seconds in jewish comunity. Regardless the fact that Harry wore that costume indicates that he's an idiot and we should pray that he NEVER get's the throne. Not very likely to happen after this mess.

 

The very first time I went to Amsterdam, many many moons ago, right after emerging from centraal station, the girl I was travelling with asked a middle aged guy working at the information kiosk how to get to "Rembrantplatz" and he bit her head off: "Plein! Plein! Not Platz! Plein!" And this was the guy they have to greet the tourists!

And one shouldn't underestimate the power Nazi propaganda had at that time; just because they pulled Bach, Wagner, etc into their cause, and they employed alot of classical imagery in their art and architecture doesn't mean they were old fashioned. On the contrary, they were very sophisticated and innovative with their use of media, from print to radio to tv. Hitler's favorite (neoclassical) architect did some amazing projects, an early kind of "virtual architecture, using lights (strangely enough, this was a precursor to the post 9/11 tower of lights in nyc), and his favorite director Leni Riefenstahl, was also very innovative in her use of editing, close-ups, mass ornament, etc. Sometimes people think Soviet propaganda was more artistic because of the importance art history gives to Russian Constructivism, or film history gives to Eisenstein, but Stalin marginalized these people right quick in favor of much less imaginative neoclassical Soviet realism.

 

Regardless of the rights and wrongs, he should have been well aware of all the dramas that his actions would cause. He must have known that all this storm would happen.

 

Excatly my thoughts, if there's one group of people who grow up with etiquettes, it's royalty. Yes, i think he gave it some good consideration, and then decided to step on some toes by wearing that uniform. Shows that royalty has their fair share of dumbasses too, it's not just the peasants.

 

Wisdom is not linked to what family you're born into. Sure it was in poor tase to wear that costume, but if it wasn't a royal wearing it, then it wouldn't have made a darned bit of difference. But no, it's a royal. News for a bloody month!

 

I think it's been blown totally out of proportion. It was a private party that the media shouldn't have been at. OK it was totally thoughtless in hindsight, but I'm sure it wasn't intended to offend and it wasn't as if he was idolizing Nazism. I've always treated fancy dress parties for what they are - to make fun of other peoples costumes and have them make fun of yours. Hardly propounding Nazi ideals is it?

Sidenote
I am guessing that the "colonial" aspect of the fancy dress theme was the fact it was an African Korps costume i.e. The German colonies in Africa.

And just to show one stupid idea deserves another, the EU justice commissioner Franco Frattini has said the EU may ban the use of Nazi symbols in Europe. So does that mean the Sound of Music will be banned? What about the West-end show "The Producers"? Indinanna Jones? Bye-bye certain episodes of Dad's Army, Fawlty Towers, and other British comedy's. Not to mention all the old war films. All of these have a depiction of the Swastika somewhere in them.
Sheesh, banning something being shown is like trying to sweep in under the carpet and pretend in never happened. Much better to hold it up to ridicule and stop it ever happening again.

 

Well, i'm pretty sure it WAS his intention to offend, because that's what Harry likes, being an attention seeking little prick. And what better way to get attention then to dress up as a nazi ?

And i'm sure those tv shows will be left unharmed. There a difference between watching it on tv in films and docus, or when someone actually starts parading in such a costume right in front of you.

 

Carcaroth, surely you realize that there's a difference between banning murder and banning all films that depict murder scenes? Well, the same applies here. The public display of symbols related to NS is prohibited in Germany. Nevertheless, we haven't swept anything much under the carpet but rather dealt with it - in some way or other.

Besides, there's not much about the NS times that I find ridiculous.

Right. That should be enough of being goody-two-shoes for the next two months. I'll go for something more non-pc and sinister next time...