Sadness was originally a sin

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That's the wisest thing I've heard in a long time.

The same thing goes with Goth. Death is not something to be taken lightly. Some kids may be struggling to deal with the death of a loved one, but I think most of them are posers playing dress up.

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Have you ever met a Mormon leader? Attended a service? Know SFA about the doctrines preached?

Youa re entitled to your opinion, of course, but I would ask that it at least be one that is informed, and yours clearly isn't.

And this is coming from a Mormon who is currently questiioning many elements of his faith.

 

I don't care if people have reasoned criticisms of my faith. I can deal with that. I also understand when people have had unpleasant experiences with it, as some fellow board members have. But wild comparisons and facile crap just pisses me off no end.

 

I am talking about religions as they began, not how they are followed/used/abused today.

Like I said, religions have been started by men to raise themselves above others in society, Joseph Smith jr in my view is a perfect example, he concocted a story which would raise him to idolatry above his potential followers.

or do you believe his story?

not a leader, no.

does a baptism count as a service?

In their basic concepts they are not negative, but when handed to man they can easily be abused, justice can vary depending on who sees it, just as greed.
for example, in York (england) it is legal to shoot a scotsman with a bow and arrow unless its sunday this was legal and seen as justice - plenty of people believe that an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth is justice, others see revenge as being wrong.

 

I know that, was a joke.

And I had no intention to start any religious debates with this thread I just thought the concept of sadness as a sin was very deep. I also found the ancient symbolism intriguing. I'm sure they had good reasons for choosing the animal, colour and punishment in hell to go with the sins. I'm just trying to figure out what those reasons are.

 

Sorry to be part if the derailment, my fellow Canadian, but when comments are made toward my faith that would never be accepted if directed at another group, say, homosexuals, without a HUGE accusation of bigotry, I get right torqued.

And as for idolatry, if you are using the word in its literal sense, you are wrong. Anyone who knows the first thing about LDS doctrine knows we do NOT worship Joseph Smith. If you are using it in a more figurative sense, I can understand why some would think that, though I of course disagree.

A baptism is a fair enough service.

 

What exactly do you mean "raise above others in society"? I really don't think Jesus and the Buddha were just egotistical jerks who wanted to seem better than everyone, and I also don't think the Amish want to be raised above others either....

 

damedog,
you forgot the quakers, clearly the worst of the lot.

 

Ahem... Goth is not about death. Goth is a combination of aesthetics - both visual and musical - and attitude which boils down to individuality and appreciation of darker things in life. Good deal of goths out there are pretty damn far from kids -in my particular cadre of goths, I'm the kid and I'm in my mid-twenties. The assumption that goth is just a phase, automatic gateway to suicide or violence, etc, is an incredibly harmful and disrespectful.

 

I stand convicted of hypocrisy(sic). However, in my defense, my personal experience with Goths has been as I described it. Many of the kids I taught went through Goth as a phase. And one was definitely working through the death of her mother. But I am not so arrogant as to assume my experience is exhaustive or definitive. Apologies and respect, Arabwel.

 

Sounds more like emos or scene kids than actual goths

I have met several people who believe that the construction of religion is that of control. To me that's incredibly naive.

You don't see such argument for politics or science yet just as many people use them as their tools of power.

If you're going to have a bugbear about one might as well rail against the other institutions used in a similar vein.

In regards to the animal correspondences - I'd probably say it's to do with the punishment associated with it. As some of the lore and stories on animals correspond that way.