Would You Like To Know God Personally?

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Deparra;

Great point! (and go read my WHOLE post now!!! )

What would be worse, for a doctor to begin surgery and then stop because he thought it was hurting the patient too much, or for the doctor to be ruthless and not stop cutting until the whole disease is taken out?

I don't know why there is evil in the world, but I do know that God has a reason, and he will only allow enough pain to make it "perfect"

btw ... it takes as much faith to be an atheist or agnostic as it does to be a Christian.

 

Mathetais, I'll read you whole post when you learn to spell my name correctly!

Your point about faith being integral to atheism is also right on track. While it is true that we cannot scientifically prove God, it is also true that he cannot be disproved, either. I once read a letter to an editor that said, basically, that just because 'the missing link' had not been found, it did not mean it would not be someday found, so she believed in the missing link, and therefore evolution. Their argument was basically all about faith, and here she was running down religious faith! Too funny.

 

OFF TOPIC: Depaara, when you atlked about the missing links I thought that you was talking about links on the web as a story. Silly me.

 

Yes, I'd expect him to have a billion opinions on todays world.

 

Really Elios, you ask the question as though you think it's not possible for people to already know God. That's what faith is all about, isn't it? Mathetais, Depaara and Ivanji have all made similar points, and very eloquently.

There's a big difference between knowing God and practicing a religion. While I'm not a member of any recognized congregation and have beliefs that would make Math sit me down for a good talking-to, I do believe in God and recognize his/her/its influence in my life. How much more personal a relationship do you want?

 

Thank you Rallymama. That was better said than my reply so now I hope that he understands.

 

I find it interesting that all the negative comments made are from a background that is grounded in or very familiar with the Bible. Well, what if the understanding of the Bible or the Bible itself was incorrect?

Would there be a different response if the foundation was different? I wonder how a Muslim would view all this?

 

Knowing God personally implies knowing God *well*, personally. Not just as some sort of friend of a friend.

Now, this would not seem a bad thing as it is. But considering I am still just a mere human (at least, I want *you* to think that way ), I would hardly be able to take this life the way I'm supposed to while knowing the ultimate form of existence... personally as you said. Put as simply as possible, it's the same as visiting heaven, and then being forced to live on earth with some pathetic humans, as opposed to a God.

 

Bah. God. He who, if the bible can be believed, is omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent. Then why the hell did all those atrocities happen throughout humanity's history? Why did he allow September 11th? Why did he allow a turd like Saddam to come to power? Why are the jews and muslims, his followers, killing each other? Ethnic cleansing of the Kurds? And these are only recent events. The Spanish Inquistion? Holocaust?

[Offensive parts removed.] -Tal

[ March 20, 2003, 21:38: Message edited by: Taluntain ]

 

Couldn't have said it better than Shura.

Only lightsabers instead of katanas.

(Eze's twisted humor. Flame away. I don't care.)

 

Did He allow? Or did He leave us free will and respect His gift once given?

As for your impressive vocabulary and captivating style, it's being reported to moderators right now.

 

I hate to break it to you, Khazraj, but the Muslims come from the same basic place as the Bible -- they, like the Jews, consider themselves to be the descendants of Abraham. Much of the Koran references the Bible, and Islam reveres most Old Testament prohets as such -- they also consider Christ to be a prophet (though not the Son of God).

Perhaps a Hindu's perspective, or a Buddhist's, or a non-anti-Christian atheist's?

You made a good point -- sorry to nit-pick.

 

Well even I see Christ as a prophet, as well as Mohammed, Zarahustra, Budha and Nietzsche

 

Nietzsche as a prophet. I'll bet he would have liked that remark.

Why is everyone talking about "knowing God" on a personal basis as though it's an impossibility? Anyone familiar with the Bible ought to know that a personal relationship with God is what Christianity (and even biblical Judaism) is all about. In the beginning, Adam walked and talked with God every evening in the garden of Eden. Even after the fall, Enoch walked with God, and became so close that world concerns lost their meaning and the earth lost its hold on him. After reading Psalms, who can doubt that David had a very personal relationship with his Maker?

So I'm happy to say that I DO know God, and I find the relationship to be irreplaceable. I literally do not know what I would do without Jesus Christ in my life, but I know I'd be miserable. Fortunately I will never have to find out, as He has promised to be with me always; I am one of His children, and He takes care of His own.

 

Nietzsche had respect for those people I just mentioned, his greatest book was about Zarahustra.
Weird huh? for a cynical atheist?

Nietzsche prophezised(sp?) about the coming of the Ubermensch, a necessary step in the evolution, both fysical as mental.. one step closer to "God"

Nietzsche didn't have a problem with Jesus, Nietzsche had a problem with you..
In the New Testament Jesus said that everybody should find their own knowledge, because he loves the lost sheep more than the entire herd.
Jesus had a distaste for blind followers and that's where the church comes into place

[ March 21, 2003, 09:48: Message edited by: Morgoth ]

 

Oh really? So what do you two talk about when sitting on the couch in evenings, or walking down the park in weekends? What's his work like, has he told you? What does he even look like?

Please. Knowing God personally is a bit different from just throwing a few prayers at him each day and going to the lord's room on sundays. I have a highly religious person for a roommate and even she doesn't go that far. No pun intended, just that there's a limit for how much holier-than-thou hypocricy I can take.

 

I hardly think that Capstone's post could be reasonably described as holier than thou or hypocritical. There is more to many people's religion than "a few prayers thrown God's way and going to church once a week." If someone doesn't understand that, fine, but name calling someone because they feel something you don't is . . . wrong.

 

Yeah you know, we athys are all kinda jealous because we couldnt find God, no matter were we searched..

Under the chair, couch, behind the comp, in the basement.. we just couldn´t find him

 

All the atrocities happened because humans chose to make them happen. If God went around blasting everyone who did something bad, there wouldn't BE free choice. Besides, and I'm not being personal here, but, the guy is GOD. He created the universe. Humanity continues to exist because He wants it to. Who are you to question Him? Have you created life recently? Anyone? Didn't think so. He works on a level so far above ours that we can't possibly understand why He does things, or lets other things happen, until we actually do meet Him.

As for right now, I wouldn't know what to say to Him. I mean, the guy literally knows everything. He knows what you're going to do aeons before you do.

 

Depaara. Sometimes nit-picking is necessary, especially when there are nits about...

AFAIK muslims don't consider themselves descendents of Abraham, perhaps followers is a better description. Only some arabs could claim to be his descendents. And there is only 1 single verse in the Koran that is a direct quote from the Bible.

Perhaps muslims would find it different because they don't believe that God blamed all of humanity for Adam's mistake. Nor do they believe that God abandonded the world to later redeem it through a son. No vicarious atonement through blood.

They also believe that all good and bad are a result of human actions in the world. It is pointless to blame god for my sins and crimes, since I commited them. Every court in the world realises this.

So, those people who pose questions like, "if God is so good how did he allow so many murders and 9/11? etc..." they pose this question because their understanding of religion is based in Christianity that says, "believe in Jesus' shed blood and All will be forgiven".

Amongst those of an Islamic background this posed question does not make sense because they know that all good and bad deeds done by an individual matter on the Last Day and so people who commit evil deeds (such as in 9/11) will have to face the music. They don't believe that a criminal can get off the hook by believing that their sins are paid for through another's innocent and unnecessary death.

Shura.
Why do groups of "non-God followers" (eg. Indians and Chinese) kill each other? Does this prove God exists then?