WW2 - The Graf Spee (And apparently, anything to do with Battleships . . .)

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Other then penetrating 36 feet of 5000 psi compressed strength concrete and the ability to knock out any bunker within 25 miles of the shore, I can't think of a reason to have a battleship.

One round has a 150' kill radius versus armored vehicles. A nine gun broadside will clear a path a half-mile wide. The Marines seem to like that. And at only $800 per ton it's the most economic firepower around (compare to a $1,000,000 Tomahawk or smart bombs at $20,000 each -- plus fuel).

But they also burn 3,000 gallons of fuel per day and are a bit expensive to operate. Besides, the Iowa investigation (not accident) ensured there will never be another battleship.

 

And whom are they going to be used on? Wars aren't fought anything like how they used to be. Sadly.

 

The abilities of the big guns tie in well with the current military strategy of the US. It's called littoral warfare -- meaning the majority of the fighting will be in the coastal setting. The most probable threats to the US and its allies comes from smaller countries that, for lack of a better description, hate capitalism. The majority of defenses in these countries are near the shoreline. There is no guaranty of friendly countries bordering the hostile nation and so all attacks must be initially directed from the sea. The shore bombardment capability of the battleships cannot be duplicated by any current warship -- the closest thing to it is carpet bombing by B-52's.

The battleships were originally to be used to support the Marines when recommissioned in the 80's, but then politics got involved.

 

For the moment, true. How long that will remain the case is an open question.

 

The topic was a battleship (according to BA) -- it was a natural progression (with a bit of help).

 

I was unaware of the cheaper cost. Certainly there are other subs and warships that can also perform these tasks, but like you said, it would be with something like a Tomahawk missile.

 

Actually, there's not. Tomahawks have no armor piercing capability and the 5" guns are woefully underpowered for any significant 'beach softening.' There are also no armor piercing bombs that I know of and fortified bunkers present a significant problem for air strikes (one bunker in Iraq required a specially designed bomb -- which was literally a 8" gun barrel packed with explosives). Also, the 7 mile range of the 5" guns put the ships in range for attacks from the shore.

To tie into the topic... even the 11" guns on the Graf Spee ( ) could do a better job of clearing a beach than current warships/aircraft. In fact, it was the US Navy's cancelling of the 8" gun that prompted the return of the Iowa class battleship (and the Marines still don't have an adequate replacement).

 

That 8" gun-barrel evolved into the GBU-28 after Desert Storm. Apparently it can penetrate 100 feet of dirt or 20 of concrete.

There're a number of other AP bombs listed here under "penetrators".

Fuel/Air Explosives, Hellfires, and AGM-130s are supposedly effective against bunkers as well, though there you run into problems of classification if you want to discuss performance.

Oh. Uh. Topic. Right. Um, the Graf Spee couldn't fire guided missiles, and modern warships can. There we go.

 

I misspoke (mistyped?), I do not really consider anti-tank weapons as truely armor piercing (I guess they are, but the weapons are still not effective against a fortified bunker). Most AP bombs are anti-tank weapons. Even a 3" gun can take out a tank. Of which the Graf Spee had six (cough, cough).

The 16" common round will take out a squadron of tanks. Even the GBU-28 has only half the penetration of a 16" AP round.

 

Well, that's rather impressive. I'm sold. Who else wants to bring back the battleships?

 

The GBU-28 got improved into GBU-43 B MOaB.
There's also a Massive Ordnance Penetrator, that is to be built, so I think there's no need of new ships.

 

Well, if it's deployable from a B-2, great. If we're stuck using B-52s to deploy it, well...

let's just say I'm glad I'll never have to fly one of the BUFFs in hostile airspace.